this post was submitted on 04 Dec 2024
330 points (98.5% liked)

Technology

70049 readers
3930 users here now

This is a most excellent place for technology news and articles.


Our Rules


  1. Follow the lemmy.world rules.
  2. Only tech related news or articles.
  3. Be excellent to each other!
  4. Mod approved content bots can post up to 10 articles per day.
  5. Threads asking for personal tech support may be deleted.
  6. Politics threads may be removed.
  7. No memes allowed as posts, OK to post as comments.
  8. Only approved bots from the list below, this includes using AI responses and summaries. To ask if your bot can be added please contact a mod.
  9. Check for duplicates before posting, duplicates may be removed
  10. Accounts 7 days and younger will have their posts automatically removed.

Approved Bots


founded 2 years ago
MODERATORS
(page 3) 50 comments
sorted by: hot top controversial new old
[–] [email protected] 49 points 5 months ago (5 children)

That's fine, I've closed the door on supporting Microsoft. They could have just charged for the 'upgrade' and that would have been better since it wouldn't result in the colossal amount of e-waste that this is creating. Even without the forced obsolescence, their products have become hostile, invasive and generally just a PITA to use. Meanwhile Linux distros are knocking it out of the park lately.

I really don't know what Microsoft are thinking. They haven't made particularly good strides towards gaining any kind of goodwill, so once it becomes common knowledge that alternatives not only exist but actually show them up, those lost customers are people that they will never get back. Look how pathetic their marketshare is for Edge for example, even though it's the default browser on Windows. They still haven't been able to shake off the bad stigma that Internet Explorer had (and to be fair, they aren't doing people any favours with Edge either).

load more comments (5 replies)
[–] [email protected] 4 points 5 months ago

Microsoft really playing into the bit. This is all just hype for Windows 12

[–] [email protected] 39 points 5 months ago (2 children)

Linux adoption intensifies

load more comments (2 replies)
[–] [email protected] 9 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago) (2 children)

Why have we stopped talking about how the $15 ~~TPU~~ TPM can make upgrading older systems possible? Does that not work anymore?

[–] [email protected] 8 points 5 months ago (1 children)

I think they also prevent most CPU released before 2017ish from installing as well so computers just missing the proper TPM are few and far between anyway. You can still get around all the requirements pretty easily though.

[–] [email protected] 5 points 5 months ago (1 children)

My Ryzen 1700 system was prevented from upgrading and it met the TPM requirement, it just wasn't whitelisted. That CPU was released in 2017, and that whole gen was pretty popular (1600 sold like hotcakes). I think anything newer should work though.

That said, my primary OS is Linux anyway, so it doesn't matter, this is just an install on my other disk in case I need something Windows-specific (haven't needed it in years).

[–] [email protected] 1 points 5 months ago (2 children)

I think anything newer should work though.

I've got a Ryzen 3700X and my computer told me it couldn't do the upgrade, either.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 5 months ago

Dang. Is your board in the 300-series? Maybe it's that?

I haven't checked, but I think my 5600 is compatible. Maybe I'll check sometime, but I'm not looking forward to the mountain of patches I'll need just by booting into it again.

load more comments (1 replies)
load more comments (1 replies)
[–] [email protected] 98 points 5 months ago (1 children)

This feels like such a fuck you to working class. People can’t afford another layer of these costs right now.

[–] [email protected] 16 points 5 months ago (1 children)

They don't need the hardware to run an OS. They need the hardware to run their AI shit for reasons nobody ever needs - except Microsoft.

So maybe it is not Microsoft closing the door for older hardware, but older hardware closing the door for Windows 11?

[–] [email protected] 21 points 5 months ago (1 children)

They need the hardware to run their AI shit

The requirement is for TPM, not parallel processing hardware. It provides trusted hardware, facilitates things like DRM.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 5 months ago (1 children)

There are tons of low and medium boards that provide TPM, and they don't suffice, IIRC.

[–] [email protected] 8 points 5 months ago (1 children)

Did you read the article text? It's specifically discussing how Microsoft will not relax the requirement for TPM 2.0.

[–] [email protected] -5 points 5 months ago (2 children)

Which is on the market for more than six years now. That was my point. It does not only need TPM2.0, it also needs CPU and RAM in regions that are way more recent than TPM2.0

[–] [email protected] 2 points 5 months ago

The CPU is due to instruction set requirements. The first version of W11 is technically compatible (with hack to pass the checks) with older CPUs than the newer versions. And it's not Gusty's guaranteed that there ones that currently can run it will do it after a few updates.

I hate it, and they could have done things to allow more compatibility, but it's not without a technical reason.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago) (1 children)

...

I feel that this is diverging from your original comment, but okay, Windows 11 -- as with all prior releases of Windows -- has minimum CPU and memory requirements. That isn't what the article text is discussing, but fair enough.

But I don't see any association with that and AI. This isn't parallel processing hardware being discussed.

load more comments (1 replies)
[–] [email protected] 5 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago) (2 children)

https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/lifecycle/products/windows-10-home-and-pro

Windows 10 Home and Pro

Retirement Date: Oct 14, 2025

Sounds like 2025 is gonna be a good year for PC manufacturers.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 5 months ago (5 children)

I'm waiting for the planned obsidence lawsuit myself

load more comments (5 replies)
[–] [email protected] 7 points 5 months ago (1 children)

With sales from companies? Yes. With sales from average consumers? Maybe not. Depends on what they can afford. There's people out there still using things like windows 7. If the computer still works they're unlikely to upgrade unless they care about having the newest stuff.

[–] [email protected] 8 points 5 months ago (1 children)

A friend of mine just messaged me, that we cannot play a few selected games anymore, as his notebook was acting up. Upon further investigation I found out, that he is still running Windows 8.1 and cannot use Steam anymore, since Steam support on Windows 8.1 ended about a year ago and a Chrome update "finally" broke Steam on windows 8.1 a few weeks ago.

load more comments (1 replies)
[–] [email protected] 20 points 5 months ago (1 children)

I'll see you all on SteamOS in six months

[–] [email protected] 12 points 5 months ago (5 children)

Love Linux and steam deck, but AS IS, steam os is a horrible choice for a desktop general use computer.

It's immutable without layering, so there are things that you can't install/keep after an update. Case and point, printers. You can't print, period. Valve knows, they don't need a gaming device to print so they don't care.

Hopefully they will do something about this, but I don't hold my breath for 2025

[–] [email protected] 2 points 5 months ago

I think printers is kinda going the way of having to support winmodems for Linux... Just not as important as it used to be.

Last time I printed something was for a pistol permit. 3 years ago. And I just sent that to Office Depot to print it, and picked it up on the way to the permit office.

Students at the local uni don't really need printers, either. Generally, the few times they do, there's public printers to email the doc to, and go pick up (Or, QR code and a phone, etc).

Personal printers just aren't that big of a deal these days.

load more comments (4 replies)
[–] [email protected] 22 points 5 months ago (2 children)

The used market is going to bomb if older machines can't be setup with newer windows version.

[–] [email protected] 8 points 5 months ago (2 children)

'incompatible' hardware will be dirt cheap, and 8th gen or newer will sell for more than it would have otherwise--especially if tariffs jack prices up on new hardware.

i have a couple dozen older systems here. most were given to me before win11's requirements were known. fixing and flipping them for a few bucks was a small but relatively steady income stream, but not anymore. hardly anyone wants them.

the couple that are new enough to be blessed by microsoft will be kept, and i'll hang on to the better ones of the rest (like skylake, kaby lake) to put linux on. everything else will end up at ewaste recyclers even though there's absolutely nothing wrong with any of them other than the fact that a profit and 'shareholder value' driven megacorp says they can't be used anymore.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 5 months ago

Maybe the tariffs will serve to cull a bit of the consumist impulse the US suffers of.

Regarding if a machine is desirable or not: I'm still seeing Windows XP machines being sold today for over 100€. No monitor, no peripherals, no nothing: just the machine. And people needing a machine to type a report, do a spreadsheet, do basic office work, with no other option, pay for it.

i run my machines until they stop working, period.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 5 months ago (2 children)

It's fairly trivial to bypass Microsoft's hardware requirements for windows 11 afaik. Just install via Rufus and click the relevant options. I agree with you that MS should have made these optional recommendations though, we shouldn't have to use third party tools.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago)

You can do that, but then the major updates MS pushes out twice a year won't install via Windows Update anymore.

load more comments (1 replies)
[–] [email protected] 28 points 5 months ago (2 children)

All the better for us running Linux!

[–] [email protected] 5 points 5 months ago
[–] [email protected] 8 points 5 months ago (1 children)

I think I can see 3 "new" laptops in my future!

load more comments (1 replies)
[–] [email protected] 64 points 5 months ago (2 children)

My dad's bringing his PC to my house when they visit for Christmas so we can setup Linux as a dual boot for him to see if he can switch from Windows 10 to Linux instead of buying a new PC

[–] [email protected] 2 points 5 months ago (1 children)

I think my retiree parents (and in-laws) are going the same way. They only use their computer for email and search, and the options are just better.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 5 months ago

I'll have to ask my parents about it. They mostly just use a web browser, but they also occasionally use Word for writing Christmas letters and whatnot. I could probably get them to switch to LibreOffice, Google Drive, or Office365, but not completely sure about that. They are interested in getting a Chromebook, so I guess we'll see what they end up needing.

I try not to force Linux on anyone, but I have brought it up before as a suggestion (they were complaining about their computer being slow, and ended up buying a new one). My dad really likes Windows, but they really don't use anything Windows-specific other than Word anymore.

[–] [email protected] 54 points 5 months ago (7 children)

My dad (in his mid 80s) told me proudly that he had just bought Linux and installed it on his computer. It's great that he wanted to try Linux but I wonder what malware-riddled scam distro he found, and how I'll sort it out on my next visit.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 5 months ago (1 children)

Doesn't Ubuntu and a few other distros still sell physical install discs?

[–] [email protected] 6 points 5 months ago (2 children)

They used to, but I don't think they do anymore. In fact, I think they used to send one to you for free. I got an official Ubuntu install disk for free at college (someone was handing them out), and I've been on Linux ever since.

I do see Ubuntu install USBs on Amazon, but I wouldn't trust those.

load more comments (2 replies)
[–] [email protected] 11 points 5 months ago

Not sure if it was Mint or Ubuntu, but one of them shows a donation box with a default amount when you click download. It's already downloading when the box shows up, but maybe he misinterpreted that.

[–] [email protected] 10 points 5 months ago

Maybe elementaryOS? There is a Purchase button on the site, with a pay-what-you-want option. If possible to enter 0 though.

[–] [email protected] 30 points 5 months ago (1 children)

Can't be that bad. Some distros accept donations. It just could be that he felt he was making a purchase rather than just a donation.

[–] [email protected] 17 points 5 months ago (3 children)

Hopefully it's just something like this, not a scam.

load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (3 replies)
[–] [email protected] 46 points 5 months ago (1 children)

Thank you Microsoft god bless I will stay on core 2 duo forever 🙏🙏

[–] [email protected] 37 points 5 months ago (1 children)

It would be safer to use a Linux flavor and run the apps you need using Wine/Proton..

[–] [email protected] 26 points 5 months ago (8 children)
[–] [email protected] 18 points 5 months ago (1 children)

It has KDE, which I believe has something close to it.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 5 months ago (6 children)

Yup, Linux can look like whatever you want. I made my old Ubuntu install look like Windows 7 for the lulz once, but now I'm too lazy to change the defaults.

load more comments (6 replies)
[–] [email protected] 14 points 5 months ago (1 children)

The important questions. I miss aero so much.

load more comments (1 replies)
load more comments (6 replies)
load more comments
view more: ‹ prev next ›