Ask Lemmy

Sorry dude, there's nothing you can do. They're not going to change their beliefs regardless of what you say or do. Ya either gotta accept that this is who they are and find a way to work around it, or you cut off all ties and go your separate ways. It really sucks but there's no reason to waste your energy on something futile. It will be a waste of time and just leave you disappointed and upset.

I moved out when I was 18 and mostly don't talk to much of my biological family.

I think a psychologist would say that if you really can't find common ground, it's best to agree not to talk about it.

Indoctrination is highly effective. Your parents were raised in a place where toeing the line is the norm and questioning those in power is traditionally a great way to ensure you disappear. Russians are deeply indoctrinated when compared to western nations because that's how their society has been set up since 1922. The Soviet leadership ruled by suppressing any dissent, violently and without remorse. Just because the Soviet Union no longer exists, doesn't mean their ways of doing things disappeared too.

The only way to change them would be to engage in an equally sophisticated program of indoctrination: deprogramming as it's called. Since you lack the resources of the Soviet Union, it would be a much more difficult task, especially since your parents are now older and their brains are less changeable. They were indoctrinated as children and by a very prolific system. Reversing that now, by yourself, is a tall order.

I'm sorry your parents were failed by their leadership, it's truly a shame.

Is "here" in the US? Or somewhere else in the West? I'm mostly asking because I could probably give more concrete tips if it were in Germany.

Have they ever met a refuge from Ukraine? Did they talk with them?

As for things like wind parks or climate policies or economics I think it is important to find a way to present that as "this is directly financially beneficial for you". Here in Germany, let's say, different independent financial institutions have calculated the total tax burden based on your income bracket if different parties were in power and went through with their plans. And lo and behold, of course FDP, CDU and AfD would have very much increased the tax burden on low to middle income people. Or they calculated that the great sounding plans of these parties would cost like 150 billion euros - which is an incredibly high sum - and explaining this away with "oh we'll make the economy prosper" doesn't work either (more calculations that are irrelevant if you're not in Germany).

My honest tip is don't make it about ideology. If you want to keep talking about politics, don't talk about liberation. Don't talk about foreigners, nazis, climate change, DEI or LGBTQ. Your best bet is money. And safety maybe. But as others have suggested - reconsider whether you even want to throw pearls at swine and try to convince them of something different.

And don't forget that a lot of behavior is a reaction of fear. In the beginning of the war there was a great podcast episode of Екатерина Шульман where she tried to emphasize that in times of aggression, it is a very natural response of the psyche to align with the aggressor. Your parents neither want to see the country they came from, love and probably idealize (as we always do with our past, especially when we don't fully beling somewhere new) as the Bad Guy, nor do they want to be scared - for their country, for their future, for their relatives, for you.

Also, I just want to say, my condolences, and I deal with similar stuff. My family is either apolitical or opportunistic, and the best case scenario is "well both sides are bad". I've been scared to call my grandpa who has первый канал running 24/7 for a year after the war started, I can guess what side he is on. If you ever want to just vent about how awful and difficult it is, feel free to write me.

It's damn exhausting to discuss political topics with them, [...]

Then don't, and if that's the only thing they're willing to talk about, make passive aggressive remarks about their lack of conversational creativity.

Immigrants to where?

What's more important to you: having a relationship with them or changing their views? I don't mean this as some kind of "gotcha" thing. This is the choice you need to make.

You already have your simplest solution to this (don't talk politics with them), but you made this post because you don't like that solution.

Thankfully most things in life aren't so black and white. It's possible that you can work on them very very softly and slowly over time, but this all comes down to what you can stand in order to keep your relationship with them.

I personally think that attempting to avoid political topics with them is the best direction to go here, but it's not my parents or my choice to make for you.

Science. Use the truth: find articles, researches and data.

Block their access to propaganda channels. Don't tell them you are doing this. Make it look like it's malfunctioning, if you can. Expose them more to educational material.

Example: Swap fox sub with vox. Set the child lock on their tv. Domain filter facebook in their router or throttle the service to make it unpleasant to use. Set up url redirects. Get them a stack of dvds. Proper entertainment is better than propaganda. They watch that crap cause they are lazy and it's easy.

If they give up and switches to a more sane channel for their entertainment, politics or otherwise, you have succeeded.

The idea is to remove them from the constant barrage of propaganda from bad actors. If they stop hearing about "evil trans people" every ten minutes, they will probably become uninterested after a while.

It helps if you have siblings on your side who can shout them down. Genuinely. 3 vs 1, or 3 vs 2 is still enough to open their minds on some topics.

Meet force with force, but only if you have an army. If you're an only child, a more subversive approach is required

@ieatmeat

To quote mc Paul Barnum

"They’re scared of change because they are new to it. So don’t demand change on the face. Change can be fluid. Sometimes it’s all right to give up on adults who worked themselves stupid."

If you live with them it could be tricky but let them know you will not be talking politics or any kind of emotionally charged topic with them going forward. Lets keep it light and stick to the things we agree on and leave everything else at the door. Avoid talking about them or saying you or sounding accusatory to minimize defensiveness, just let them know these topics and conversations are not how you want to use your time and energy and thinking anymore.

If they start trying to drag you into a forbidden topic, simply let them know you are heading off to do something since you dont have anything to add or contribute to topics that you are uncomfortable with like you mentioned to them before.

Start with this and let us know if they bite. I've got some other ideas but start with this and see how it goes. At the end of the day, engaging in these kinds of discussions over and rehashed constantly is damaging and pointless so the key is transcending them by not participating in them or feeding the wrong wolf. Be polite and respectful but also assertive that you will not be dealing with these topics any longer

Should I just declare to never talk about politics with them again since it’s pointless?

Yes. I thought that was obvious, when have you ever seen children being able to convert their parents?