this post was submitted on 19 Aug 2024
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    Framework 2880 x 1920 (new) display review (lemmy.world)
    submitted 4 months ago by [email protected] to c/[email protected]
    96 comments fedilink hide all child comments
     

    Wuuttup. I'm here complaining again about Framework's Linux unfriendly display. The new one this time.

    https://frame.work/products/display-kit?v=FRANJF0001

    Old display, 2256 x 1504 (3:2)

    GNOME

    100% scale

    • Nothing looks blurry
    • Everything is tiny
    • Unusable

    100% scale + large text accessibility

    • Nothing looks blurry
    • Most apps scale appropriately
    • Some apps don’t respect GNOME’s large text setting (Alacritty)

    125% scale

    • Most apps look blurry (Picard, Firefox, Spotify, Alacritty)

    200% scale

    • Everything is way too big
    • Unusable

    Plasma

    100% scale

    • Nothing looks blurry
    • Everything is tiny
    • Unusable

    125% scale + Apply scaling themselves

    • Nothing looks blurry
    • Most apps scale appropriate
    • Some apps can’t scale themselves and look tiny (Picard)

    125% scale + Scaled by system

    • Most apps look blurry (Picard, Firefox, Spotify, Alacritty)

    200% scale

    • Everything is way too big
    • Unusable

    New display, 2880 x 1920 (3:2)

    GNOME

    100% scale

    • Nothing looks blurry
    • Everything is tiny
    • Unusable

    100% scale + large text accessibility

    • Nothing looks blurry
    • Most apps scale appropriately
    • Some apps don’t respect GNOME’s large text setting (Alacritty)
    • Everything is tiny

    150% scale

    • Most apps look blurry (Picard, Firefox, Spotify, Alacritty)

    200% scale

    • Everything is way too big
    • Unusable

    Plasma

    100% scale

    • Nothing looks blurry
    • Everything is tiny
    • Unusable

    150% scale + Apply scaling themselves

    • Nothing looks blurry
    • Some apps can’t scale themselves, but look a little better here? (Picard)

    150% scale + Scaled by system

    • Most apps look blurry (Picard, Firefox, Spotify, Alacritty)

    200% scale

    • Everything is way too big
    • Unusable

    tl;dr

    In the old display, GNOME at 100% + large text was the best compromise. In the new display, Plasma at 150% + Apply scaling themselves is the best compromise.

    Interestingly, Picard scaling itself looks super tiny in the old display, but in the new display it looks... better. It's still not correctly scaled like native Wayland apps, but it's better.

    Warning

    If you can't stomach moving from GNOME to Plasma, then 🚨 DO NOT BUY THE NEW DISPLAY 🚨. The new display is worse for GNOME.

    Once again

    I am once again begging Framework to just give us a damn regular DPI display that works! Without workarounds. Without forcing users on specific DEs. Without forcing users to stop using their favorite apps. This new display has basically all of the flaws as the previous one.

    (page 2) 47 comments
    sorted by: hot top controversial new old
    [–] [email protected] 73 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago) (4 children)

    So hardware manifacturers need to adapt to XOrg now? LOL the reason that some apps dont scale right even on Plasma is that they are probably not Wayland native yet.

    And GNOME still doesnt have stable fractional scaling, unlike Plasma.

    Hardware vendors shouldnt need to adapt to GNOME too.

    [–] [email protected] 8 points 4 months ago (1 children)
    [–] [email protected] 7 points 4 months ago (1 children)

    Woopsie

    [–] [email protected] 4 points 4 months ago

    Last paragraph too

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    [–] [email protected] 5 points 4 months ago (8 children)

    Thanks for the write up. I was in a similar situation with a 4k 14 inch Dell something, instead of scaling at 200%, I lowered the resolution to half at 1080p and it worked flawlessly. Maybe you could try it too?

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    [–] [email protected] 11 points 4 months ago (2 children)

    Just tried 100% + large text on Gnome, it feels much better than 125% scaling, thanks for letting us know it's a possibility!

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    [–] [email protected] 27 points 4 months ago (1 children)

    scaled by system/themselves ... looks like those are x11 apps. why is firefox into this? run it as native wayland with MOZ_ENABLE_WAYLAND

    [–] [email protected] 21 points 4 months ago (1 children)

    Not necessary anymore with current version Firefox. It has Wayland enabled by default now.

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    [–] [email protected] 6 points 4 months ago

    Is it that bad? I run gnome on two 4k monitors with 100% scaling and large text and it's great

    [–] [email protected] 48 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago) (2 children)

    I have basically zero issues with fractional scaling with Gnome on Wayland, I thing you probably have something configured wrong.

    Here's a screenshot of how a few programs look for me with 125% scaling on my original framework display. The only thing slightly blurry is spotify but it's not enough to be noticeable in normal use. 1000008665

    Edit: Looks like lemmy actually compressed my screenshot a fair bit but I think you can still tell that things are scaling properly

    [–] [email protected] 3 points 4 months ago (4 children)

    Ayy, beast in black! Saw those guys live (and barely knew them, lol). They make good music (their "beast in black" song seems to be my favourite).

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    [–] [email protected] 4 points 4 months ago

    Huh, I actually run Plasma at 100% with my FW13 2256x1504. I didn't know there was a new display, but if I had it, 100% wouldn't cut it anymore. Frankly, for such a small display, I wouldn't desire a higher resolution than what I have in the FW13, even if all the software scaled properly.

    [–] [email protected] 11 points 4 months ago

    You should try 110% and 130%. Dunno if it's the 5's but those seem to work better for me.

    [–] [email protected] 8 points 4 months ago

    I installed one of these new displays this past weekend and it looks fantastic in Linux. Granted I've only tried Plasma so far on Wayland but that's because I really don't find Gnome usable. It looks good at 200% though and a similar scale to 150% on the old display.

    [–] [email protected] 5 points 4 months ago (1 children)

    How are you feeling about the Framework otherwise?

    [–] [email protected] 7 points 4 months ago (4 children)

    It's all right otherwise. Not phenomenal, but not crap. The specs you can get with other laptops. The hardware feel isn't as good as a Dell XPS or an X1 Carbon. The expansion card stuff is kinda cool, but other laptops have ports too. I've never swapped out the cards.

    The main reason I bought this laptop is repairability. If that's not your main priority, then I probably wouldn't recommend this laptop.

    If you want to use this laptop with Linux and not spend time fixing hardware compatibility issues, then I definitely would not recommend this laptop. Definitely get a Dell XPS for a Linux laptop that Just Works.

    [–] [email protected] 2 points 4 months ago

    If you want to use this laptop with Linux and not spend time fixing hardware compatibility issues, then I definitely would not recommend this laptop. Definitely get a Dell XPS for a Linux laptop that Just Works.

    Have you tried the -framework images from uBlue?

    [–] [email protected] 2 points 4 months ago (1 children)

    Framework would be an instant buy for me if not the 3:2 screen. I'm not a developer, so there's no upside for me

    I just want the repairability

    [–] [email protected] 11 points 4 months ago

    After spending a few months on the FW16, going back to a 16:9 laptop feels... wrong. Like there's a ton of vertical space missing. Everything except watching movies benefits from a little bit more vertical space.

    [–] [email protected] 3 points 4 months ago (1 children)

    Appreciate you taking the time, thanks.

    [–] [email protected] 2 points 4 months ago

    I agree with pretty much everything they've said, though I've gotten more use out of the swappable parts. I have a desktop I use for things I need a powerful system for, but being able to swap in the GPU when traveling is great.

    When I'm at home I have basically everything on USB C and the empty expansion bay.

    When I travel I swap in the GPU and add an HDMI port and some USB a ports.

    If you don't have stuff set up like I do I agree it's mostly just a reparability / upgradeability thing.

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    [–] [email protected] 42 points 4 months ago (1 children)

    96 DPI should be a choice, agreed. But it's a software issue when an app or a framework doesn't display well on HIDPI.

    [–] [email protected] 14 points 4 months ago

    Just to make sure, have you logged out and back in after applying the scaling? Some apps look blurry until you do that. Try to avoid quarter scaling, no x25% or x75%...

    [–] [email protected] 57 points 4 months ago

    Meme is right, in 2024 poor HiDPI scaling is a software issue

    [–] [email protected] 179 points 4 months ago (6 children)

    I am once again begging Framework to just give us a damn regular DPI display that works!

    Bottom Skinner is right, though. It's 2024. HiDPI has to be supported by all toolkits, desktops, and applications at this point. There are no excuses. Even 1080p on a 14" laptop screen warrants 125% scaling, IMO.

    [–] [email protected] -1 points 4 months ago (1 children)

    HiDPI has to be supported by all toolkits, desktops, and applications at this point. There are no excuses.

    I mean... yeah, I agree. Would you mind sending that email to the millions of devs around the world? Not sure if they're aware of this.

    I just want to be able to read my screen. 😭

    [–] [email protected] 42 points 4 months ago

    Would you mind sending that email to the millions of devs around the world?

    Yes, I mind. For Qt5 applications, basic HiDPI support can be patched in with a single line. I actually did that for a handful of applications, tested them, and then submitted pull requests on Github. I cannot program, so all I could do is to copy and paste that one line from the Qt documentation. It's not much but I already did my part.

    [–] [email protected] 84 points 4 months ago

    "This hardware works fine and even has compatible software that it works great with. But I'm going to prefer the broken software for other reasons. And that means it's the hardware's fault."

    Software that is built to be compatible with a wide variety of hardware should be compatible with a wide variety of hardware.

    If software can't handle a 16.5:16 aspect ratio, then that's bad software. I don't care how weird of a niche thing that is... just make your software abstract enough to handle those cases.

    It's 2024, any resolution/aspect ratio/DPI combo should be supportable. There's enough variety of monitors out there that we should have a solution for handling things on the fly without needing to have a predefined solution.

    [–] [email protected] 55 points 4 months ago (2 children)

    Scaling for HiDPI displays is unacceptable on every desktop OS, it is crazy that so little effort has been put into making the experience of modern monitors good.

    [–] [email protected] 7 points 4 months ago (2 children)

    I've had most stuff look good with Plasma 6. But not perfect.

    [–] [email protected] 2 points 4 months ago

    I've found that it's mostly ok at some settings but less so at others. As in it will display well at 125% but not necessarily at 135%.

    [–] [email protected] 42 points 4 months ago (2 children)

    I feel this is one of those few sectors, like wifi compatibility, where Windows completely destroys Linux, MacOS, and BSD. As someone who regularly switches between operating systems on bare metal & 4K, trying to use a HiDPI display on *nix is painful and will only kinda work with caveats after 100 hacks (as seen here), whereas Windows has a zoom slider that just works.

    [–] [email protected] 3 points 4 months ago

    Interesting, as someone running 4k, p1440, and a 1600x1200 three monitor setup, this makes me nervous about switching.

    I never even considered Linux having scaling issues in 24'

    [–] [email protected] 18 points 4 months ago (1 children)

    macOS seems to handle this pretty well, honestly. About the only issue I have is XQuartz and even it’s pretty good.

    What’s the issue you’re seeing?

    [–] [email protected] 5 points 4 months ago (3 children)

    Scaling, MacOS has no actual scaling it will only lower the resolution, and using Retina on anything that isn’t sold in an Apple store (and even then) just simply does not work. It essentially has no HiDPI support past using native resolution with slightly larger text that is not adhered to by most of the operating system itself. I am at a loss at why you think this is well handled, what criteria are you using?

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    [–] [email protected] 31 points 4 months ago (2 children)

    Would you be happier with 640x480?

    [–] [email protected] 22 points 4 months ago (3 children)

    Seriously, cannot go back. When MacBooks came out with retina, got one and got a program to run at native resolution. So much data and text on a screen! Looking forward to this display with 100% scale. Full stop. Everyone always says my text looks tiny but I love it! Dual 4k monitors, no scaling on my desktop Linux. My old Alienware laptop was 4k oled, gnome and KDE looked fan frickin tastic! I'm not buying pixels to not have em go to full use.

    [–] [email protected] 2 points 4 months ago

    "I paid for the entire display so i'll use the entire display"

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    [–] [email protected] 68 points 4 months ago (2 children)

    Blurry apps come from xwayland compatibility. Firefox and alacritty (or other terminal like wezterm or kitty) have native wayland, with no blurry check Archwiki for example HiDPI. With Spotify, live with it or use spot (gtk client). Hopefully next gnome release incorporate something like plasma, and then ctrl+ native in spotify increase its size.

    [–] [email protected] 12 points 4 months ago (1 children)

    Or use spotify from the browser

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