I don't necessarily like their reasoning, but I'll take their votes.
this post was submitted on 20 Dec 2024
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Can someone explain this to me I’m not a U.S. citizen… trump isn’t even the acting president yet so this makes no sense to me..
The real people in power are those who tell the best stories.
This tale is as old a civilization: a sword is powerful, but more powerful yet is a pen to instruct a thousand swords.
Maybe we have forgotten that, in this analogy, the pen isn't literally a pen in an oval office, rather it is a tweet plugged straight into people's brains.
Too many of you incorrectly assume that the real power of persuasion can only come from inside the Whitehouse, or some other institution, just because historically that is where it came from.
He has no official power, but a lot of current Republican congressmen are spineless little shits who will do anything he tells them to do. And apparently Elon wants the government shut down so bullied trump into pushing for it
Why does Musk want to shut down the gov? Does he gain something from it?
The right wing essentially wants to destroy the government, because they think the free market solves everything.
They don't think the free market solves everything. They think a weaker government is easier to control and that struggling government workers are easier to buy.
He may want to shut down some agencies that are currently investigating/ prosecuting him until trump actually gets in, like the national labor relations board and the epa.
Thanks for simplifying it and explaining it to me. How do you feel about Elon musk being involved in politics? It’s a little scary I think
It's honestly just business as usual in American politics, our leaders have been corporate puppets for decades. The only scary part is that they think their victory is so absolute that they can drop the mask.
It's horrific and the logical conclusion of allowing billionaires to buy lawmakers. Now they're just being completely direct about it instead of hiding behind other lobbyists.
• Aaron Bean (Fla.) • Andy Biggs (Ariz.) • Josh Brecheen (Okla.) • Tim Burchett (Tenn.) • Eric Burlison (Mo.) • Kat Cammack (Fla.) • Michael Cloud (Texas) • Andrew Clyde (Ga.) • Eli Crane (Ariz.) • John Curtis (Utah) • Jeff Duncan (S.C.) • Russ Fulcher (Idaho) • Bob Good (Va.) • Paul Gosar (Ariz.) • Andy Harris (Md.) • Wesley Hunt (Texas) • Doug Lamborn (Colo.) • Debbie Lesko (Ariz.) • Greg Lopez (Colo.) • Morgan Luttrell (Texas) • Nancy Mace (S.C.) • Thomas Massie (Ky.) • Richard McCormick (Ga.) • Cory Mills (Fla.) • Alexander Mooney (W. Va.) • Blake Moore (Utah) • Nathaniel Moran (Texas) • Ralph Norman (S.C.) • Andy Ogles (Tenn.) • Scott Perry (Pa.) • Bill Posey (Fla.) • Matt Rosendale (Mont.) • Chip Roy (Texas) • David Schweikert (Ariz.) • Keith Self (Texas) • Victoria Spartz (Ind.) • Thomas Tiffany (Wis.) • Beth Van Duyne (Texas)
As someone not in the US, I'm hoping someone can explain.
Trump isn't in office yet. How can he have any say in this, other than just blowing hot air?
This is decided by the House of Representatives, which is currently controlled by the GOP. They can't get their act together to decide to do either what they were working on for months, or do what Trump says (he wants to add a debt level increase), or do what musk says (refuse to pass it).
President Musk is threatening to use daddy's money to primary anyone who doesn't lick Trump's diaper ring
99.99% of GOP members are spineless cowards that will do whatever their daddy tells them to.
Translation: They are scared of backlash from his supporters and donors. Figuratively speaking, our legislators are bought, not elected.
People realize trump, elon, and the magat cult want the government shut down? This is exactly what they wanted. They want it shut down until trump is in. Go listen to what Victoria Spartz, one of the 38 repubs that voted no said on fox news. They want Johnson out as speaker and elon in. And every other Republican is blaming the dems for shutting the government down, not those 38. THE CULT GOT EXACTLY WHAT THEY WANTED.
Trump publicly backed this new bill, and 38 of them voted publicly against it. It makes Trump look weak and Trump hates looking weak. He wouldn't have backed the bill if he thought it was going to get shot down like that
They could make peace (aka Johnson could shut up and choke down some orange D) but I don't see Trump and our truculant Speaker really getting along well. Johnson is a principled corrupt shitbag, an actual Christian nationalist, while Trump just uses Xian nationalism as a prop.
Good reminder that there are fights to be had for his agenda and they are not forgone conclusions. They will have just a 3 seat majority in the house - and a 1 seat majority for a couple months with their planned vacancies. If they can lose 38 votes on their own funding bill, they can lose 3 on others
I think part of the key here is encouraged infighting between Trump and his Cabinet (mainly Musk). They're all CEOs in one way or another and CEOs don't like being told what to do.
The Democratic party actually seems to be getting that memo
The “President Musk” messaging is by design, at least partially. This week, according to a source with direct knowledge of the matter and another person briefed on it, at senior levels of different Democratic congressional offices, and also within the Democratic National Committee, discussions have been had about having party leaders and elected officials actively portray Musk as effectively Trump’s boss, and to do so during television appearances that the president-elect is likely to see. The idea is that it’s a cost-free opportunity to potentially drive a petty wedge between the notably mercurial and ego-obsessed Trump and his similarly emotive pal Musk, and to sow some chaos in the upper ranks of the Republican Party.
https://www.rollingstone.com/politics/politics-news/president-musk-dems-troll-trump-elon-1235211922/
They're just fighting over the bag, which happens within the GOP during the best of times. Just because they aren't uniform in certain policy doesn't mean they won't rally together to strip rights away from minorities, or enact more Christ based fascism.
I mean Matt Gatez already dropped out because he couldn't get the senate votes. You won't win every fight but that doesn't mean you can't win some important ones
For instance, the ACA survived narrowly, but it survived after people fought its repeal in the first term. It died in the senate narrowly. They had a much larger house majority (+26 more seats) then and it still barely passed the house 217-215
You only need 3 "moderate" republicans to vote against it. Or 3 MAGA republicans to vote against it because of petty reasons (maybe they're mad at the bill's author). Or just a few absences - there's republicans with attendance issues
People know that Trump isn't going to be there for them in the next election cycle.
He also has little to no loyalty. He'd throw anyone under the bus to make a dollar.
Did you see the pictures of his first wife's grave?
He planted her on a golf course because you can't tax a cemetery
And I bet they're just waiting for the day he finally kicks the bucket. He did what they wanted him to do, namely deliver them a win. As there won't be another one, he's no longer useful.
Look at how MLK became a conservative icon after he died.
Ray Bradbury called out Obama for not funding more space flights; after Ray died he was suddenly a life long GOP
A real mess. Happy Shutdown Day.
Washington Post: “One major reason 38 Republicans opposed the bill is because of the last-minute insertion to lift the debt limit. It’s a congressional requirement that is usually necessary every couple of years, but one that no Republican likes to do and many refuse to vote for.”
“Trump had been asking Johnson to lift the debt ceiling before he takes office, two House GOP sources familiar with the request said. But one of the sources said Johnson had been reluctant because he said he doesn’t have the votes.”
because of the last-minute insertion to lift the debt limit
Last minute? Wasn't that the whole intent?
*Now that I'm reading the article:
Trump threw Johnson a surprise curveball by demanding lawmakers increase the U.S. debt ceiling—an issue that previously had nothing to do with negotiations to avoid a government shutdown.
A limit increase is different from lifting the limit. The wording is admittedly quite similar, but lifting means removing completely. So this whole song and dance never happens again.
Wouldn't that be removing the limit? To me "lifting the limit" means increasing it.
I'm only stating what the facts are. Often as it relates to law "lift" has an alternative meaning of to remove. Sometimes you see it with "lifting a ban" or "lifting restrictions".
Now that I read the article:
Trump threw Johnson a surprise curveball by demanding lawmakers increase the U.S. debt ceiling—an issue that previously had nothing to do with negotiations to avoid a government shutdown.
Thanks for that. The site doesn't load for me with my current settings, so I figured it was more of this: https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/donald-trump/trump-calls-abolishing-debt-ceiling-rcna184820
Indeed; the debt limit forces Congress to show up for work and make decisions, including ones that aren’t politically expedient. If it is permanently lifted, the executive suddenly has an unlimited checking account, with limited accountability. Having that limit is what keeps congress in control of what gets done.
I don't think having that limit realistically affects much other than government employees having to work unpaid for a while, but it is an area I feel like a compelling case could be made either way.
The original intent was to fund the government. The debt ceiling is a much different thing.
I thought it was funding the government by increasing the debt ceiling.
The debt ceiling does not need to be increased to fund the government at this time. This was a Trump demand to suspend the debt limit 2 years.