this post was submitted on 09 Sep 2024
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[–] Smoogs@lemmy.world 56 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago) (1 children)

In cancer world this is why patients are instructed to print in large letters “AMBULANCE” on an envelope pasted to their fridge. It informs anyone coming to their house to not resuscitate . So likewise it Should be on neighbour to inform everyone of his DNR before calling a lawyer or laying any blame. You have no ability to see his chart as a bystander. He should own that. Nothing was stopping him from going around and informing his neighbours to not try to resuscitate if he expected any less. And that is on him.

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[–] PenisDuckCuck9001@lemmynsfw.com 64 points 4 months ago

NTA, if he wanted to die he should've done it behind closed doors

[–] AllNewTypeFace@leminal.space 29 points 4 months ago (1 children)

Could have been worse. He could have been from a culture in which saving someone’s life means that you become responsible for them for the rest of their life. Then you’d have had to rig up some kind of situation in which he saves your life so you become even.

[–] Dasus@lemmy.world 16 points 4 months ago (2 children)

Do you have a real life example of a currently existing culture with such a practice?

Because I feel like you've seen a few too many movies.

[–] LucasWaffyWaf@lemmy.world 5 points 4 months ago (2 children)

I vaguely recall having heard that before of somewhere out in eastern Asia, but I can't recall where at. I'd be curious to see what that's about.

googles

Found this.

[–] Turbonics@lemmy.sdf.org 5 points 4 months ago (1 children)
[–] LucasWaffyWaf@lemmy.world 5 points 4 months ago

Yes, and the reasoning behind why it's considered such is also detailed in the link itself. I figured I'd leave that link as a way for folks to read into it and learn where the claim originated from.

[–] Dasus@lemmy.world 3 points 4 months ago (1 children)

That's not a "life-debt" as much as it's just regular insurance debt.

The same logic would apply in western countries, but the practice we have make it less likely you'd get away with murder so actually driving over someone to kill them on purpose after an accidental crash isn't quite as common as in China.

Nothing to do with "saved your life so now I'm now responsible for it".

[–] LucasWaffyWaf@lemmy.world 3 points 4 months ago (1 children)

Which is exactly what I wanted to clear up with the Snopes link.

[–] Dasus@lemmy.world 2 points 4 months ago

Fair enough

[–] tetris11@lemmy.ml 14 points 4 months ago

Couldn't find anything on "blood debt" or "life debt", with the closest being a reddit article that references a Kung-Fu movie in 70s that popularises the idea

https://www.reddit.com/r/askphilosophy/comments/pj5gvd/is_there_a_philosophy_behind_the_idea_that_if_you/

[–] Fosheze@lemmy.world 185 points 4 months ago (4 children)

First responder here. The DNR doesn't mean a damn thing until it is literally in your hands. Until that time you respond as though there is no DNR. If you're wrong and they did have one but just didn't have it on hand then you accidentally save someones life, you're still legally in the clear, and I guess they can just die sometime later. But if the DNR turns out not to be real/legitimate and you didn't act just because you were told there was one then you just killed someone and you're completly fucked.

If you have a family member that has a DNR then be damn sure everyone knows where that thing is because unless you have it physically there when they are dieing then it doesn't mean anything.

Of course in places like nursing homes there is a different procedure. They know who has one on file and they will usually tell dispatch about it before the ambulance is even sent. But if it happens just in your home or someplace then the ambulance crew can't just take your word for it; they need the document in hand.

[–] AeonFelis@lemmy.world 40 points 4 months ago (3 children)

The DNR doesn’t mean a damn thing until it is literally in your hands.

How does the DNR get into the first responder's hand in practice? Do you get an emergency call and drive there as fast as you can through red lights with your siren on only to be greeted by a relative that made the call handing you the DNR document?

But if the DNR turns out not to be real/legitimate

Are you responsible for validating its legitimacy while in the field, when every second counts?

[–] yeather@lemmy.ca 30 points 4 months ago (1 children)
  1. Sometimes, yes, many times a family member may call EMS to hand them the DNR, this ensures proper procedures are followed when dealing with the body, less mess, and a quicker certification of death. It may also be important in situations where the person is influencial or rich and ensures you cannot be accused of foul play.

  2. No, DNRs have certain things that make them official, signatures and notarized markings. Usually one person will begin life saving measures while the ither verifies the DNR. EMS never work alone.

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[–] Amanduh@lemm.ee 10 points 4 months ago (1 children)

What if I just avoid people who look like they're dying?

[–] yeather@lemmy.ca 33 points 4 months ago (3 children)

Not illegal, good samaritan laws protect you either way. However, there is a “duty to rescue” if:

1: You created the hazard that lead the person into danger, you must provide rescue.

2: A special relationship exists. Spouses must rescue each other, parents must rescue children, employers must rescue employees, property owners to invitees but not trespassers.

3: In some jurisdictions you have a duty to notify, which is usually calling the police, but you do not have to take any measures to help them beyond that. Only 10 states require this and is never actually enforced.

[–] Amanduh@lemm.ee 7 points 4 months ago (4 children)

So if your spouse is drowning and you're not a good swimmer you have to go die with them or you get in trouble? Obviously if there is a flotation device you'd use that but what if there isn't like in a river or something?

[–] EpeeGnome@lemm.ee 17 points 4 months ago (1 children)

I realize that other comments have already explained the law better than I could. I still wanted to say that fortunately, jumping in to drown alongside them doesn't legally count as "helping," so there is no expectations for anyone to do so.

[–] Amanduh@lemm.ee 5 points 4 months ago (1 children)

I was hinting at the fact that drowning people will drown you to live themselves lol

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[–] yeather@lemmy.ca 3 points 4 months ago

You have to take “reasonable, actionable steps to rescue another in a hazardous or dangerous situation.” This may mean just calling the police, or in a case like drowning, throwing a life preserver and flaging down a lifeguard.

[–] fluckx@lemmy.world 9 points 4 months ago (1 children)

Note: I am not a lawyer.

You're legally required to help, not risk your own life while doing so. If somebody is drowning you need to call the emergency services and if there is a rescue buoy close by you can throw that as well and try to pull them to shore that way.

I am not a lawyer, but I think in the majority of cases you should be covered by calling the emergency services.

As a side note: unless you're a lifeguard or have had proper training, jumping in to save somebody drowning is dangerous. A person drowning will try to hold on to anything to stay afloat and will likely try to push you under trying to stay above water.

[–] Amanduh@lemm.ee 2 points 4 months ago

Yeah the holding other people down for one breath of air is what I am talking about, I was being a tad silly with my question but I appreciate your answer

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[–] Lumisal@lemmy.world 5 points 4 months ago (2 children)

Does it count if tattooed on their chest?

[–] yeather@lemmy.ca 14 points 4 months ago (1 children)

No, courts have ruled the tattoo could mean anything, and you need to provide the documentation for it to count. The tattoo could lead to them looking for a DNR though.

[–] _stranger_@lemmy.world 12 points 4 months ago

"Ask about my DNR" would be a funny tattoo.

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[–] NigelFrobisher@aussie.zone 3 points 4 months ago
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