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I'm normally an anti-slippery slope person but there's a definite escalatory nature to how paedophiles operate, it's easy to see how images of fictional children can evolve into images of actual children.
How is this argument different than the "video games cause violence" argument?
The "video games cause violence" argument is wrong, because the vast majority of gamers don't try to use games as a substitute action for violent behaviour.
But there are of cause at least some mass murderers and school shooters, that have played violent games in order to fulfill their violent phantasies, couldn't do so in a long term and murdered real people instead.
Same goes with pedophiles. They want to fuck a child, use fictional characters to fulfill the phanstasy, get used to it and then escalate to pictures of real children and eventually real children.
Do you have any real-world or professional experience with people suffering from pedophilia?
I don't, but I doubt that stance as being unfairly projecting some idea of how things have to work on those people.
I for one can jerk off to the weirdest porn fantasy things, from the usual thinly-veiled step-siblings trope to rape play, weird power dynamics or tentacle porn (depictions of children not among them, I feel I have to mention that explicitly here), but I don't have any desire to experience any of that in real life, because I absolutely know it would be wrong.
I don't see why that should neccessarily be different for them.
I have been schooled on pedophilia in a professional context, during my undergrad and in a work-context. Yet I have not worked with pedophiles directly, nor have I had any contact to one, that I would be aware of.
Looking at the science both of our positions are reflected. As with so many things the answer is not a simple "yes" or "no".
If you want to take a bit of a deep dive, I recoment this study from 2023.
It looked at both of our positions: FSM (Fantasy Sexual Material) leads to real sexual violence against children vs. FSM reduces the risk of said practice.
Here is their summary of my position (FSM leads to sexual violence against children):
Here they are summarising your position, as far as I understand it (FSM helps to prevent sexual child abuse):
They conclude, basicly, that more research is needed:
So, there we are. A long post to say maybe.
I suppose both of our positions might be viable and it can't be said yet, under what circumstances each one of us might be right.
Thanks for putting the work in, to coin such a well-rounded response on a topic that is usually easily derailed.
You seriously exceeded my expectations.
I cannot read through that whole review right now, but it was an interesting read already for as far as I got, taking into account a lot of nuance to the topic, that one doesn't usually find in public debates. (Or at least, I wouldn't expect to find on a taboo topic like this. It's not like that's something I regularly discuss, just something I had thoughts about when reading comments under a random meme.
I guess I have nothing to add. You clearly understood my meaning very well and as the paper states, there's probably more research needed. I'd hypothesize, that engaging with such material can lead to both outcomes, just as it can for depictions of other illegal activities. The case might be warped however, because people who are exclusively attracted to children, have no way of acting out on that with a real person, whithout it being illegal and immoral, while people who are (also) attracted to adults have a plethora of possibilities. (And can live out some of their sexuality at least, even if they have trouble finding a partner that consensually takes part in their most extreme kinks)
So yeah, complex issue. Thanks for your valuable contribution.
On the contrary, I was happy to engage with a position that wasn't along the lines of "all pedophiles should commit suicide".
It is, as you say, a complex issue. That complexity and any nuance is usually absent of discussions about the topic on the Internet. Thanks for adding it here.
Because as I said, people with an interest in CSAM tend to escalate in their behaviour. Most don't jump straight into child pornography but start with less serious things like jailbait and non-sexualised images of children etc. It doesn't take a huge leap to see the same pathway with images of fictional children.
I'm not suggesting that everyone into this material will go on to abuse children or start to consume actual CSAM but there's a non-zero amount of actual paedophiles who started their journey with this exact material.
It's that the same with violence, people that want to commit acts of violence may start by acting out violence in video games?