this post was submitted on 22 May 2024
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Management is ordering pizza for the office and sends around a sheet asking what everyone wants.
The third-party voter is the last one to get the sheet.
There are 10 votes for pepperoni and 9 votes for cheese.
The third party voter hates pepperoni, and thinks cheese is a bit boring, so he votes for the anchovies in his heart.
He has wasted his vote since cheese would be vastly preferable to him than pepperoni, and anchovies had no realistic chance of winning. That's why everyone thinks third party voters are ridiculous.
To make this more realistic:
Management decides that the pizza choices are: sardines or anchovies.
The ~~workers~~ employees want pepperoni, but that’s not an option management allows because they are in the fishing business
God, I wonder if some people have ever even talked to other US voters in their lifetime.
God, maybe someone will listen to the voters for once.
https://news.gallup.com/poll/642695/majority-disapprove-israeli-action-gaza.aspx
Oooh a poll! Shall we see if it was funded by a right wing org? Any guesses as to the methodology? 20 participants? Maybe 200?! gasp dare we dream . . . 1000?!
That stuff isn’t usually in the articles for a reason
It's Gallup, Gallup is generally reliable.
The issue is that most people do not put a great deal of thought into foreign policy, and thus often have very contradictory views - such as when most American voters approved of a No-Fly Zone over Ukraine after the first days of the war, but if asked if they would support a No-Fly Zone if it had the risk of US jets shooting down Russian planes (you know, exactly what a no-fly zone IS), half of those supporting swapped their opinion.
Gallup is generally reliable, for a pollster, so I looked:
So, war-dialing and hoping (a) the person picks up (b) the person doesn’t hang up immediately © wants to give their opinion for 20 questions, and (d) yes 1,000 people out of 80 million voters. Also it was two months ago.
Not to mention, the headline is “Approve of Israel’s actions” not “Understands what diplomatic and political issues are involved”.
That’s like the message being “95% of people want ice cream for dinner, so vote out mom & dad and let’s go with the guy in the creepy van”
Where’s the poll that suggests people are ok with the Biden administration’s approach in Israel? Are there ANY polls that support it?
I see you didn't actually read the poll I replied with. Here, let me help you out:
I did read it, and I may have arrived at a different conclusion than you.
Would you say any of those percentages add up to, “Yes, supporting the active genocide is worth supporting.” ??
...
This you?
Yes it’s me. Now try for the context in which both quotes were pulled. Cherry-picking partial quotes here
Okay, full context.
This you?
And yet whether the current level of US support for Israel is correct or not remains deeply divisive
But sure, it's just "the workers" with their very undivided and definitely coherent view who are getting ignored, not that the general electorate is not a particularly useful political grouping for most issues in modern politics.
Anyway you try to spin it, apologizing for aiding a state engaged an active genocide is really not a positive
No, it's not. But "I'm going to give power to the guy who wants to offer unlimited support to Israel's genocide AND start a few genocides at home too, as well as abolishing what democracy we do have in this country and selling out Ukrainians to be genocided by Russia" is not really an alternative that should be taken seriously.
So the Biden administration has no power in stopping aid? Because it’s happening rn on his watch. Whatever possible future comes is a result of actions today…
What aid can they stop? Don't say something stupid like "sending weapons" or "military aid". Since you have limitless knowledge of foreign policy and diplomatic relations with Israel, give me specific examples of aid that Joe Biden can unilaterally stop that would end the Genocide™ today.
We'll even ignore the fact the Bibi said they would continue the assault on Gaza even if the United States cut off all aid. Just tell me the aid that Biden can suspend that will end the Genocide™ today.
Stop moving the goal posts. Bibi is able to carry on because of Biden’s support. Biden stops giving aid and Bibi can’t carry on. It doesn’t take much to see that
What support can the Biden administration unilaterally withhold to so that Bibi stops carrying on? Be specific.
Stop sending military aid to Israel, and don’t pursue sanctions on the ICC. Two very simple things
What military aid can Biden stop sending that will stop the Genocide™? The ICC arrest warrant didn't stop the Russian genocide in Ukraine, why do you think they will stop Netanyahu?
What exactly are you in support of here? Be specific
So you have no specifics on the aid Biden could stop that would stop the Genocide™?
Until you do everyone should assume you have no idea what Biden could do to stop the Genocide™ but you're enthusiastically talking out of your ass spouting gibberish because someone on tiktok told you that Genociden Biden© was solely responsible for the actions of a sovereign nation that he isn't president of.
Just so there's no ambiguity I specifically support a peaceful transition to a two state solution. After that I support the United States aggressively investing in Palestinian infrastructure and security so that the people of Palestine will have the means to support and defend themselves without having to rely solely on the good will of the UN and neighboring Arab states and Iran.
As for a solution to the current war in Gaza, I support strong political pressure on Israel to remove Netanyahu from power without permanently damaging the Israel/United States relationship. It's an incredibly delicate balancing act that will largely be invisible to the public eye. If not done correctly it could backfire on the United States by showing we abandon allies, which will further weaken our standing in the world, and increase the power that Russia and China have in the region.
A likely outcome of not handling this situation correctly is for the United States to burn all of its influence with Israel and still not stop the war in Gaza. It's important to remember that Netanyahu just needs to hold out until the next election; if Trump gets elected then Bibi will have carte blanche to do what he wants in Gaza given Trumps strong track record of supporting the most extreme forms of Zionism.
You ask for specifics and yet cannot provide anything specific of your own. Classic
Lol, I gave specifics. Way to make a stupid claim, cry about getting called out on your stupid claim, try to turn the tables and dodge the questions calling out your stupid claim, and then hit me with the old "I know you are but what am I", all while never actually providing any support for your stupid ass claim.
Isn’t it maddening after someone provides specifies and then moves the goal posts? Turnabout is fair play, amiright? lol
🤣🤣🤣🤣 isn't maddening when you say stupid shit, get called out on it, get the specifics you ask for but refuse to provide any yourself and still keep trying to dodge and deflect without actually saying anything of value
I find trolls amusing. Anyways, here are the 2 things stated earlier…
Just stop providing military aid (I don't know what military aid we provide, or when, or where it comes from, or how it would actually impact the Genocide™) and don't pursue sanctions on the ICC (which isn't something I know existed until yesterday and I have absolutely no idea how an ICC arrest warrant might stop the Genocide™ because it never has before). Two very simple and not vague or ill defined things at all 🤡🤡🤡
Yep, those are the 2 things I listed.
Very little. It's largely a Congress thing. They decide who gets aid, how much, and where the funding comes from. Biden absolutely could do better with messaging. And his leadership has not done him many favors either. However, short of enacting war powers etc. There's very little that the executive branch can do directly. Which makes so much of the ire Biden is getting misplaced and suspicious.
He should do better. So should the people hyperfixating on him.
Messaging is very unclear because Biden says he will stop sending shipments of American weapons…and then doesn’t. And denouncing the ICC is also emboldening Bibi & Israel’s actions in Gaza. Biden wants to have his cake and eat it too
https://www.cnn.com/2024/05/08/politics/joe-biden-interview-cnntv/index.html
People say a lot of things. People only have the ability to do the things they're given. He can push for it to change. He can even expedite already approved shipments. But what he can't do is start or stop them himself. Congress can and the Republicans have shown they would override him.
I really don't know how you got that from "Don't vote in the guy who wants to give more aid to Israel and start genocides at home".
I was trying to stay on subject and not follow you down the “what about this possible future” rabbit hole. I’m not a multiverse guy. Today’s actions bears tomorrow’s fruit. This support of genocide is making for rotten choices
Oh, I'm sorry, you're right, it's absolutely ridiculous to consider one of the only two realistic possibilities of the outcome of this coming election. I really must be overworking some poor folk's brains here.
I know some people only can hold 2 ideas at a time but there are more than more choices that are available at the current point in time.
Here is one:
Option 3: Biden and his administration stops supporting Israel, and he gains support for literally doing nothing
That would be great. I very much hope that the protests push him into that.
However, Option 3 is not an option you or I pull the lever on. Option 3 is an option that Biden must choose, and as much as I'd like to slip him some subliminal messaging in his morning coffee to convince him, ultimately, neither of us can make that decision the way we can make the decision who to vote for.
So if election day comes, and Option 3 hasn't activated, you are looked at Option 1 or Option 2. And if you think "Well, I don't MIND fascism" is in any way a moral decision at that point, then I absolutely will respond with the utmost disgust.
Yet, commenting about the support of genocide is too much lol
Oh, I'm regularly involved in doing 'too much' then. Perhaps I shall flagellate myself.
Am I supposed to know who you are and your comment/post history?
If you're making a statement on my activity ("Yet, commenting about the support of genocide is too much lol") then I would expect you to have some familiarity, if you were not just making shots in the dark in an attempt to seem like you understood more than you actually did.
I’m following this comment reply thread…that’s typical when replying in context.