this post was submitted on 15 Oct 2024
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It's been trending this way for years, but seeing it graphed out like this is shocking.

What do you think are the effects of this drastic change?

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[–] [email protected] 0 points 9 hours ago (1 children)

The last really serious relationship started by meeting at a bar.

It was great because there was no expectations when we first started talking so the conversation was just natural, just two people talking. We exchanged numbers and soon started dating. I really think that it worked was because it was just an accidental meeting and we were both relaxed and had no ulterior motive.

I also think because dating in the wild there are fewer filters and few options, so you go with what you got. They may not be perfect but it's better than sitting around swiping for the perfect person that may not exist.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 6 hours ago

Yup. I'm an awkward fellow but still have far better results approaching people in bars than on apps. People on apps are constantly pursuing the perfect match (including their perfect match) so everyone is collectively disappointed.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 9 hours ago (1 children)

If anyone is jumping into this thread: ctrl+f "fake". There is a good discussion about the data that you shouldn't miss.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 6 hours ago

Thanks, yeah that's why I came here. For me though it is that a few percent got together in 1980 / early 80s. Now I vaguely remember the 80s and the "internet" from then. I can't imagine any got together from "online dating" then or the internet overall. Do you have a concept of what "internet" was then?

[–] [email protected] 0 points 9 hours ago

For me, the big question isn't what are the effects, but rather, what is the cause?

I see this as an effect of something else that other effects of could be mistaken as symptoms of this here.

Basically, the destruction of third spaces and public life in general has caused an increasing number of people to find relationships (both romantic and platonic) online because they no longer have the opportunity in their daily life. That, and the increased ease of long distance relationships and meeting people from far away means that people are probably more likely to have the opportunity to fall in love with somebody outside of their tiny corner of the world.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 10 hours ago

Meeting online seems like the best way to me. Better to date people you have stuff in common with rather than just picking your partners through circumstance.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 11 hours ago

A lot of people here are too young to get it, but work being a captive dating scene for skeezy shameless assholes is a million times worse than online dating.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 12 hours ago

I'm personally thrilled not to be bound by the recommendations of my friends or family. Or work?! Gross!

People: "Oh hey there Digital Frontier, looking forward to the opportunity" The Permanently Online: "Get out of my swamp!"

[–] [email protected] 0 points 12 hours ago (2 children)

Pathetic. Glad I did not meet better half on the f'n internet.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 11 hours ago

You meet the person you decide to be with where you meet them. I don't know where your judgemental tone comes from, perhaps bad experiences or just some stereotype. If two people meet, find they're a good match, and the relationship works, why are some ways pathetic while presumably others are the "correct" way?

[–] [email protected] 0 points 12 hours ago (1 children)

two of my friends met through an online game. they got married this year and are a happy couple.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 11 hours ago

Married 35 years. Met online in the 80s. Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't, just like any other method.

It's interesting to follow each line and see how time has affected it. I noted the "Work" line and how it goes up as women move into the workplace. Also how "Family", "Neighbor", and "Grade School" drop some as it became more normal for people to move away from their hometowns for careers or college.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 12 hours ago

I first dated online in 1999, and the first woman I dated I ended up marrying and having two kids with, though we divorced in 2017.

I still date online these days, and I prefer it. It allows me to know a little about a person before I waste any time chatting them up, and the things I need to know are things they generally put on their profile. Things like their sexuality (since I am non-binary), their political leaning (I'm socialist), their relationship orientation (I'm polyamorous), whether our values match...you know...important shit. And those early conversations before we ever meet in person are low-key enough that I feel more comfortable with them IRL, something that helps me as an autistic person.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 13 hours ago (4 children)

The collapse of society, visualized.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 7 hours ago

I don't understand it so it must be bad.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 11 hours ago

Wrong thread or phone bad?

[–] [email protected] 0 points 11 hours ago

Explain your thesis.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 12 hours ago

/c/dataisdepressing

[–] [email protected] 0 points 14 hours ago

That is kinda sad

[–] [email protected] 0 points 15 hours ago* (last edited 15 hours ago) (5 children)

I think this graph is fake. The way the data is presented is confusing, but the study they are citing doesn't seem to confirm anywhere close to the 60% figure, it seems to be saying 11.5% instead: https://www.icpsr.umich.edu/web/ICPSR/studies/38873/datasets/0001/variables/W1_Q24_MET_ONLINE?archive=icpsr

This lower figure also seems to line up with other studies: https://www.pewresearch.org/short-reads/2023/02/02/key-findings-about-online-dating-in-the-u-s/

One-in-ten partnered adults – meaning those who are married, living with a partner or in a committed romantic relationship – met their current significant other through a dating site or app.

The graph is branded with the logo of "Marriage Pact", which seems to be a dating app/service targeting college students. Maybe they made it as a form of (deceptive, unethical) advertising? I don't know, reverse image search just shows similarly unsourced social media posts, I can't confirm anything about its origins.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 6 hours ago

That's totally not it for me. It looks fake, but for me it was when this shit starts. A few percent got together in 1980 / early 80S?! Now I vaguely remember the 80s and the "internet" from then. I can't imagine any got together from "online dating" then or the internet overall. Do you have a concept of what "internet" was then?

[–] [email protected] 0 points 12 hours ago (1 children)

but the study they are citing doesn't seem to confirm anywhere close to the 60% figure, it seems to be saying 11.5% instead

I think you've linked the variable of all couples regardless of when they got together. If 11.5% of all couples met online, whether they met in 2023 or 1975, then that doesn't actually disprove the line graph (which could be what percentage of couples who met in that particular year met through each method).

The researcher who maintain the data set you've linked published an analysis of the 2017 data showing that it was approaching 40% towards the most recent relationships being formed, in 2017. I could believe that post-covid, the trends have approached 60%.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 12 hours ago* (last edited 12 hours ago) (2 children)

It could be that. I'm noticing now that the study I linked has a note about a sampling error they made:

Self-identified LGB adults were oversampled in HCMST 2017, and therefore remain oversampled in subsequent waves (2020, 2022). the weights (W1_WEIGHT_COMBO, W2_COMBO_WEIGHT, and W3_COMBO_WEIGHT) correct for this oversample.

So another possibility is that the data used for the graph is wrong because of a big correlation between sexual orientation and preference for online dating and it was made before this was corrected.

I don't think the figures are intuitively implausible, mostly I'm just bothered by the apparent lack of any way to confirm the authenticity of the graph and its relationship to the source material, or get an authoritative answer to the question of how prevalent online dating is.

One reason to doubt them though, the other article I linked says that as of 2022

About half of those under 30 (53%) report having ever used a dating site or app

Which is the demographic that uses them the most. So it doesn't make sense that more people would have met their current partner through a dating app than have ever used one.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 10 hours ago

About half of those under 30 (53%) report having ever used a dating site or app

Yes, but that's a bigger denominator, and includes single people, and even those who have never been on a date. The headline question is what percent of couples met through different methods, not what percent of individuals, including those who are not currently in a couple.

So it doesn't make sense that more people would have met their current partner through a dating app than have ever used one.

It could be that a higher percent of couples met online than the percent of people who have ever used online dating. If you have a data set where online dating is literally the only way to meet people, but only half of the people are trying that method, you'd have the situation where 100% of couples met online but only 50% of people have ever tried online dating (this hypothetical is purely to demonstrate the math, not claiming that this is in any way a reflection or the actual data).

It's entirely possible (and I'd argue is likely) that the 53% who have used dating services are more likely to be in couples than the 47% who haven't. And so that larger subset of the 47% would therefore be excluded in the "percent of couples" data.

mostly I'm just bothered by the apparent lack of any way to confirm the authenticity of the graph and its relationship to the source material

The 2019 paper I've linked is authored by the maintainers of the linked data set, and contains a very similar graph with an earlier cutoff (2017 data). I'm sure those authors know their data set. It's just most of their papers using this data is paywalled, and the data is mainly used for other types of analyses.

If I have time I might be able to download the data set from a computer and just map it either naively or by applying the correct weights.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 11 hours ago (1 children)

The last part doesn't mean that. It's 53% of the whole population under 30. Could be a higher percentage of the ones having a partner/married. Since the total is smaller if you just take the ones having a partner. Removing the ones still single/didn't meet anyone.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 11 hours ago* (last edited 11 hours ago) (1 children)

Right, I get that it doesn't strictly rule it out directly, but it's a surprising discrepancy. That 53% is just for under 30s too:

compared with 37% of those ages 30 to 49, 20% of those 50 to 64 and 13% of those 65 and older.

while the purported figure for people having met their partner through an app is for all demographics. The number of people who are partnered vs single is 70%. If 60% of those met via dating apps, that's 42% of the total. Which seems probably still more than the number of people who have ever tried them, and that would only check out with the absurdly generous assumption that those apps have a near perfect success rate and almost no one who uses them goes back to other methods.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 9 hours ago

The number of people who are partnered vs single is 70%. If 60% of those met via dating apps, that's 42% of the total.

You're still not slicing thin enough.

If 60% of the couples who got together in 2022 met on dating apps, and people who got together in 2022 constitute 5% of all couples, that's still possible (and probable), then those couples will still only be 3% of the total. Pretty easy to add up to 11% that way when you start including all the 10-year-old relationships, the 20-year-old relationships, etc.

If it were flat at 60% for all years then no, it wouldn't add up.

But if you look at the area under the curve, it's still pretty small comparatively speaking because it's such a recent phenomenon. (And not every year would actually count equally for the whole data set, but it's displayed in this chart as every year adding up to 100% for its own year.)

[–] [email protected] 0 points 13 hours ago (1 children)

I think the difference is that variable is the entire population of coupled adults. Of course not 60% of all couples met online, but I'd believe 60% of couples that met this year met online.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 12 hours ago* (last edited 12 hours ago)

I’d believe 60% of couples that met this year met online.

I think there's a question of denominator, rather than percentage, involved here.

What happens when you have a pre-online standard of 100 new interactions a year in a population of 100k single-and-looking-to-mingle daters. Then you introduce dating apps, and you've still got the base-load 100 new interactions happening normally, but now you've got apps which allow you to make thousands of interactions a month rather than a hundred a year.

Now a hundred of those power-users on Grinder all start meeting up and fucking online. 100 unique combinations gets you 4950 "couples that met" in a year. Yeah, the "met up" only lasted for the duration of a naked high-five, but its points on the board!

Compare that to 100 couples that meets outside the app, but are doing it at the more stately pace of once-a-month (so, 3 times in 100 days). rather than as fast as they can swipe through the app. 300 unique "met ups" by comparison. Kinda high by historical standards but infintessimal to the ass-slapping orgy of dating the online community allows.

As someone who watches friends on these apps go on dates two or three times a week, but never settle down (because the focus of these apps is hooking up, not settling down, and the system is engineered to keep you engaged and swiping) I put forward the hypothesis that "How Couples Met" isn't seeing a decline in non-app interactions but an enormous surge among a particular rarified group of power users milling their way through the library of potential hook-ups online.

I'd also posit that some number of these hook-ups are purely artificial (bot accounts, catfishing, onlyfans promotions, or other phony profiles) that exist purely to encourage lonely people to engage with the system and don't actually signify human-to-human interactions. As evidence of this, I'd point you to restaurants using dating apps to dupe users into becoming customers.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 14 hours ago* (last edited 14 hours ago) (2 children)

I did a search for similar studies, and most of them seem to show at least a similar drastic change.

Here's an article from the BBC (from 2016) referencing a study from Stanford:

https://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-35535424

And the relevant graph:

[–] [email protected] 0 points 12 hours ago (1 children)

Unclear what study that is referencing, but it's notable that Michael Rosenfeld is also the first listed principle investigator in the study referenced in the OP, likely part of the same project, since they list updates for every few years (How Couples Meet and Stay Together (HCMST) 2017, 2020, 2022, United States). Also unclear who compiled the graph or where it was originally published. I want to reiterate that this study itself seems to very much not line up with the graph, unless I'm misreading it very badly.

The BBC article is about a book, Modern Romance, and the book makes a claim that 35% of Americans met their spouses online ("respondents who married between 2005 and 2012"). This checks out with the cited source study, which makes an identical claim, though there's reason to be suspicious of it since it was funded by eHarmony. The scope there is a little different than "all couples", but it's still a very different number than what is in either this article's graph, or in the OP graph, which are very different from each other as well (saying the number reached 70% by 2009 vs saying it reached 60% by 2020. I would think that if these graphs are genuinely based on research by Michael Rosenfeld that they would at least check out with each other.

Here's what I think is probably going on here: people working for the marketing departments of dating apps fabricate bogus graphs, falsely attribute their source to real studies, and push them on social media to go viral. Then people writing articles like the one you linked about the subject copy paste those images without checking them, because it's just a fluff piece for a recently published book and they don't have much time to spend on it.

Where did you originally find the OP image?

[–] [email protected] 0 points 12 hours ago

Sorry for removing the comment you just replied to. I didn't realize I had grabbed the wrong graph from the article.

You could be right. I believe I found the original image circulating on reddit or tumblr (it was a few days ago).

I haven't had the opportunity to read your link directly to the study yet.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 13 hours ago (1 children)

This is for same sex couples which for a large variety of societal reasons likely wont reflect the dating scene among the average population, which skews heavily hetero.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 12 hours ago* (last edited 12 hours ago)

Oh shoot, you're right. I grabbed the wrong one. I was just looking at the dates.

The hetero graph in this article only goes to 2009, so this whole article probably isn't too helpful. I've removed. Thanks

[–] [email protected] 0 points 15 hours ago

Thankyou for digging past the headlines and showing your findings. No one has the time to do it all the time but together we can.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 16 hours ago

Look at the date of the latest piece of data, and you have your answer

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