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Starch-based bioplastic may be as toxic as petroleum-based plastic, study finds
(www.theguardian.com)
Imagine that, plastics are dangerous
this post was submitted on 13 May 2025
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Ok so what do we want? Toxic plastics that last forever or toxic plastics that break down in the environment after 3-5 years?
Because that is the gambit here. We're not going going to just get rid of plastics altogether.
Also, this article is setting off my BS meter by claiming plastics contain 16,000 toxic substances but not showing how much of that is realistically possible to get into your body. The dose makes the poison!
"This spider contains 1300 toxic substances—one of which will kill you if even a tiny droplet gets in your blood! And these spiders are out in the environment!"
Less plastic is what I want. The world is addicted and we need safe alternatives. Reduce and reuse come before recycle for a reason.
Plastic is useful in a lot of applications, but does it really need to be in everything from our clothes to our shopping bags to our bodies?
Unfortunately, most bioplastics are more like 300 years, which yes, is significantly better than 300 thousand years, and with industrial compost heaters you can push those 300 years down. But I've also had to come to terms that my failed 3D prints will likely outlive me (although I do collect the waste to hopefully recycle someday). I don't print that much compared to most in the hobby, but it is something I consider before I print things.
That said, I'm not going to let perfect be the enemy of good, and the biodegradability of bioplastics is still exponentially better than petroleum plastic.
Hm, depends how 'breaking down' is defined. Because it usually doesn't mean there's no toxic substance left. Instead, plastic degradation often IS the formation of micro or nano plastics. In this case, it's irrelevant how long this process takes without knowing how long it takes until there's no toxicity left.
Also, if something is described as 'biodegradable', I wouldn't blame a consumer for composting it. And if it actually poisons the compost, that's net harm. So, it'd be actively harmful green washing.
It is crucially relevant how long decay takes. That's why there's microplastics in your food and your body. Because plastic does not degrade for hundreds of years. Fucking Obviously, that is the single most important aspect of it.
I smell petroleum company money.
I think “no plastics” is actually what we want
Or maybe qualify that as "minimal plastics".
Are there any good alternatives though?
wood/paper, glass, metal.
For some use-cases, sure. But so many products today are only affordable (or even possible) because of plastic.
How would you make an affordable computer, for example, without plastic?
Okay, no more cheap computer sorry. You don't just get to destroy the planet to save a few bucks
That was just one example of many
Can't you see? We don't want to safe a few bucks. We want to be able to afford it without having to sacrifice our children's school tuition saving for it.
I would also like to afford a Ferrari without sacrificing my childs school tuition.
Good thing Ferrari has released a "child slave" option, cutting the price of a Ferrari by half!
Let's prioritise NOT destroying the planet first, then worry about you being able to afford brand new computers after.
Great! Let's see you trying to change the world then!
Na I'm gonna vote for any mandate that forces you to act responsibly. A ban on ICE vehicles, a ban on forever plastics, a ban on meat products. Stop destroying my planet because you want fast cheap bullshit.
Because I grew a conscience and needed to take action. Lazy people like you need to be forced via policy.
There are many medically necessary items that can't be replaced by anything but some form of plastic.
I think it's safe to say that there are obvious differences in how the medical industry uses plastic (and the kind of plastic they use) compared to the food packing industry. One directly contributes to overconsumption, the other.. probably does as well, logically, but to a lesser degree with considerably higher payoff.
I think “no plastics” is actually what we want
This is the statement at the root of this comment chain. This does not distinguish between use cases.
It should, is my point. Everything is nuanced.
Don't forget hemp
And bamboo.
Was the study funded by Big Oil?
. . . Just. Curious.
I tried to access the study but can't find it at the usual mirrors (yet). They usually just have a line like 'the study authors and funding partners do not have any conflict of interest in this area of study' so it requires a journalist or some expert to dig into the funding sources. AFAIK.
Me looking at my shiny new 3D printer after all this stuff:
Yup, this is why my printer is in an enclosure and always vents to outside no matter the filament I'm using.
Even though I kinda like the sweet smell of melted PLA. :(
It's a Prusa MK4, so I'll get it upgraded to the Core One to get it enclosed, and construct a vent.
Based on what I'm reading, the glass transition isn't the issue, it's the plastic itself. PLA is brittle, and taking supports off creates an incredible mess. I also use ASA, and while it seems to be less brittle, there's still quite a mess. (Thankfully, ASA doesn't breakdown to release the styrene until it hits 400C, and the extrusion temp is 260C. That means the accumulation of the microplastic doesn't include the carcinogenic aspect, just the ones listed and suspected of micro plastics in general).
I used to use an SLA printer since I like making minis, but the resin started irritating the shit out of me, was insanely difficult to clean, and apparently the UV reactant is carcinogenic. I stopped using that entirely 4+ years ago (maybe used it for 6 months irregularly). I want another, but not without a much better workspace and proper ventilation. Except it, as well, results in a resin copolymer that I would find extremely likely to cause the same micro plastic hazard.
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