389
While voting for Take it down.
this post was submitted on 29 Apr 2025
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nothing more than virtue signalling. they dont want to vote this act either, because they know its a thing they can use to garner votes.
More performative bullshit by Blue MAGA. The Dems controlled the house and the senate for the first two years of Biden's term. That would have been a nice time to introduce this bill and codify Roe v Wade. They are doing it now because they know it has no chance. The corporations that own the Dems are the same corporations that own the GOP. They work for corporate wealth and conservative Christian religious fanatics. Neither of those groups wants equality of any kind. The Dems do nothing when they have a majority and pretend to try to help when they have no chance of helping. This is WWE cosplay conflict.
That would have been a nice time to introduce this bill and codify Roe v Wade.
But then Democrats would have had to handle the backlash of an energized conservative movement and the complacency of a satisfied base. Now Democrats get enormous cash injections every time a Republican takes another swing at women's health and can force any leftists to knuckle under when presented with the Serial Rapist Loud And Proud Woman Hater candidate running against the Slimy Moderate Corporate Shill Who Definitely Isn't Going to Get MeToo'd Six Weeks Into Office.
The Dems do nothing when they have a majority and pretend to try to help when they have no chance of helping.
And they benefit enormously from this strategy, because liberals displace blame to the left and right of the Do-Nothing Party.
They've fully bought into the theory that conservatives must be pandered to and leftists must be disciplined into compliance. And this is the only way anyone wins elections.
Also don't forget that the rich oligarchs that control the DNC and the Super PAC money also don't want leftist policies.
Neoliberals have access to the same polling data as the rest of us, they know which policies are popular with their voters, but they choose to not pursue what's popular
The biggest motivation for the DNC has and always will be their rich owners.
Exactly. Ever since 2016, when Bernie was not the candidate after winning the primaries, I realized that nothing mattered. The elite were going to do whatever they want and there is nothing we can do to stop them. They distract us with dem vs rep dog and pony shows to divide us further. I’m seeing just as much hate and racism from the left as the right. It’s crazy. I thought we were supposed to be all about peace and love and equality. But I learned that if you don’t agree with them 100% you are a “nazi” or a “white supremacist” even if you aren’t white lol. Until we come together as united people and decide to fight back against capitalism and the billionaire elites hoarding all the resources and destroying our Earth, we may as well consider us all doomed to slavery.
Ever since 2016, when Bernie was not the candidate after winning the primaries,
Not true. Bernie lost the DNC nomination by 3 million votes.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2016_Democratic_Party_presidential_primaries
Bernie ran a good campaign, and would have been the better candidate, and the DNC put their thumb on the scale for Hillary, but he did not win the primary.
Oh fuck off and actually do something meaningful, FUCK. Sick of the posturing shit. Need to kick these geriatrics out and get some actual citizens that give a shit in these positions.
I've just lost faith in government completely.
I also don't have faith in the economy, so it's back to natural living like the Native Americans.
I'm honestly happier for it.
I feel yah man. Shit is ridiculously bleak.
Its all a show, this bill has no chance of passing and they know this. The Democrat resistance is nothing more than smoke and pretty words.
Farts and good intentions
I mean, yeah, what else are they supposed to do at this point, you took them out of every lever of power.
Don't get me wrong I think the Democrats failed as much for the next guy but getting mad at them now after you've prevented them from doing anything at all just seems petty.
what else are they supposed to do at this point
Pull from the GOP playbook.
Obstruct everything. Shut down the government. Make unholy stinks on the floor of the House parading around big blown up pictures of dead women and summon mobs of angry constituents into the halls of Congress to yell at people. Tap the Blue State governors and legislatures to push radical pro-women policies, reject federal money whenever it comes with anti-abortion strings attached, and force local businesses to toe the party line if they want to interface with state governments. Make the lives of anti-abortion groups in the state hellish by running strings of investigations that seek to scandalmonger them. Lean on the press to focus on the havoc that these anti-abortion laws are causing. Run Project Veritas operations on those Anti-Abortion front groups that exist to profit off adoption services. Have the police surround and intimidate anti-abortion activist groups, while pro-choice groups are free to block the entrances to buildings, harass staff, and generally make any anti-abortion activist in the state fear for their lives.
Maybe start with voting no on the new censorship bill that just passed with unanimous consent that Trump specifically said he will abuse to silence people.
I mean they have so many options to move in any direction other than their shoulders up in a shrug.
valid.
but getting mad at them now after you’ve prevented them from doing anything at all just seems petty.
It would seem to be a trend.
This is how the Democrats communicate their values and intentions. And 30, 40, 100 years ago it would have worked, because the public looked for alternative solutions to problems. Today, the public wants a bully to assertively stand on camera and yell at them. The Democrats don't do that, and it's to their detriment.
But the time for all of this has passed, they're rearranging deck chairs.
As much as I appreciate this proposal, now is not the time for more identity politics. Now it’s a fight for basic democracy, the rule of law and against corruption.
Get out there and DO SOMETHING, Democrats
I remember constant complaints of "The Dems didn't even TRY anything, they should have proposed bills even if they knew it would fail!" before the second Trump presidency.
Now it seems the chorus has changed to "I can't believe they're trying something they know will fail!"
Curious.
The problem is that when they decide to grow a tiny bit of spine this is what they use it for. Like, even if this bill passed it'd mean nothing in two months as the rest of democracy is dismantled around it. It's like seeing a serial killer break into your home and deciding it's a good time to wash the dishes. I mean don't get me wrong, pushing bills alone is very inadequate for supposed opposition leaders during a fascist takeover either way, but pushing LGBT rights bills? They're not even at the starting line with that.
Like, even if this bill passed it’d mean nothing in two months as the rest of democracy is dismantled around it
Okay. There are two core problems with this:
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Even fascist regimes are reliant on a highly procedural state bureaucracy in which law can still be used to delay and frustrate fascist aims - this was true even in Nazi Germany at the height of WW2, wherein lawyers associated with the resistance used legal and procedural methods that predated the Nazi takeover, and some that post-dated it, to buy time and save lives. If the fascist regime is intent on killing an individual it singles out for whatever reason, it will kill them regardless of the bureaucracy; but for the vast machinations of killing or imprisoning large amounts of people, procedural methods still have validity as tools in reducing, delaying, and even reversing individual cases. If this bill passed, and for the record I think it has a snowball's chance in hell of doing so, it would be amongst the tools which would reduce the damage the fascist regime is capable of inflicting going forward, even if not in any way a replacement for real action by society against the fascist regime.
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What the fuck are they supposed to be doing, as legislators, if not shit like this? There's no fillibuster in the House, no major delaying tactics. You could advocate for starting brawls, like another commenter did, but other than achieving the expulsion of remaining Dems with spine from the legislature, which would seem to me a negative consequence rather than a positive, I don't really know what that's supposed to accomplish more than you or me going down to the Capitol and throwing hands with Generic McFascist (R-Iowa).
pushing LGBT rights bills? They’re not even at the starting line with that.
Considering that LGBT folk are at the forefront of who this fascist regime is intent on persecuting? Would beg to fucking differ.
If this bill passed, and for the record I think it has a snowball's chance in hell of doing so, it would be amongst the tools which would reduce the damage the fascist regime is capable of inflicting going forward, even if not in any way a replacement for real action by society against the fascist regime.
According to the article:
The legislation would amend the Civil Rights Act of 1964 to explicitly ban discrimination based on sexual orientation and gender identity in employment, housing, education, public accommodations, jury service, and federally funded programs.
This doesn't sound like a procedural method that can frustrate fascist aims; it's just a sentence on a piece of paper saying "you can't do this one thing". If the Trump admin wants to do that thing they'll either pass a bill or issue an executive order saying they can. This bill is too obvious to be a meaningful tool of damage reduction; to invoke it you'd have to come out and say "you're not allowed to discriminate based on sexual orientation", which would prompt the administration to say "now we can".
What the fuck are they supposed to be doing, as legislators, if not shit like this?
Step down so people with spine can take the position and use it to do things that actually matter. What I expect from a legislator in 2025 (and to be fair my expectations are irrelevant as I'm not American) is to use their position as a podium from which they can tell the people to protest, strike, practice mutual aid and otherwise resist the administration in ways that matter. Legislation would be nice in addition to that, but representatives whose whole "contribution" to anti-fascist resistance is to write a bill and call it a day? They can fucking get lost.
Considering that LGBT folk are at the forefront of who this fascist regime is intent on persecuting? Would beg to fucking differ.
LGBT people are near the top of the regime's shitlist, but look at who is being actively persecuted right now. It's not LGBT people; it's immigrants and from there Latino people as a whole and "criminals". Of course LGBT people are going to be added to that list sooner or later, but for now the front line is still immigrants, so if the goal is to protect people the administration is persecuting they should be pushing immigrant rights bills to at least challenge the narrative Trump and co are trying to create. Pushing a pro-LGBT bill at this stage of the fascist takeover is empty grandstanding with no benefit whatsoever.
This doesn’t sound like a procedural method that can frustrate fascist aims; it’s just a sentence on a piece of paper saying “you can’t do this one thing”.
... what the ever-loving fuck do you think laws and procedures are
Step down so people with spine can take the position and use it to do things that actually matter. What I expect from a legislator in 2025 (and to be fair my expectations are irrelevant as I’m not American) is to use their position as a podium from which they can tell the people to protest, strike, practice mutual aid and otherwise resist the administration in ways that matter.
This loops back around to "My choice of practically pointless symbolic action will Rile The Masses(tm) and their choice will not!"
Legislation would be nice in addition to that, but representatives whose whole “contribution” to anti-fascist resistance is to write a bill and call it a day? They can fucking get lost.
It's not about whether the nitwits in Congress can get fucked, as individuals. The question is whether this, as the action of the still-extant opposition party, is appropriate. While it is almost purely symbolic, seeing as mentioned it has no chance of passing, it is exactly what the opposition in the legislative branch are supposed to do. It's what they're uniquely empowered to do by their office.
LGBT people are near the top of the regime’s shitlist, but look at who is being actively persecuted right now. It’s not LGBT people;
Holy fucking shit.
Pushing a pro-LGBT bill at this stage of the fascist takeover is empty grandstanding with no benefit whatsoever.
You're right, let's wait for the horses to bolt to bar the barn doors. Luckily, passing legislature is a super quick and easy thing, so once the crisis is in full swing and not just the extensive rollbacks of LGBT protections current happening, we'll be able to comfortably slot the bill.
Settle in for the long fucking haul. Build plans. Build the basis for plans. Build the basis for the fucking basis. Nazi Germany lasted 12 years, and that was with a world war to take it out. Pinochet's Chile 17 years. Franco's Spain lasted some 40 years. And, may I note, Franco's Spain came into power in a much more leftist and activist country, with extensive labor organizing, than 2025 USA.
The "Anything that doesn't have immediate effects is pointless!" view is going to get more people killed, just like the fuckwits sitting out the election in 2024 because the Dem candidate wasn't going to fix any immediate problems have already signed death warrants to the toll of literal millions.
Many of us are going to die going forward. It's unlikely that there's going to be a massive outpouring of support to save many of us. Our deaths are unlikely to provoke spontaneous unorganized mass resistance. Wishing that public attitudes will reach a fever-pitch and a crisis will save us from our massive lack of actual organization and support in the population is downright delusional.
... what the ever-loving fuck do you think laws and procedures are
Well they're many things, but laws and procedures that will be useful in the sense you described need to be ones the regime either wants to stay in place or doesn't care enough to notice. The bill in the article is neither.
This loops back around to "My choice of practically pointless symbolic action will Rile The Masses(tm) and their choice will not!"
Telling the people to resist isn't a pointless symbolic action, and the point isn't to Rile The Masses™. The masses are already (to an extent) riled; what they need now is leadership so their energy can be spent on productive acts of resistance rather than a weekend protest every two weeks. The people's sense of normalcy needs to be completely shattered so they even entertain anything more radical than calling their representatives, and that's where a half-decent opposition party would come in.
It's what they're uniquely empowered to do by their office.
And there the question becomes: Who cares? Their office is now meaningless except, as I said, as a microphone to amplify whatever message they want to deliver to the masses. The power bestowed upon them by their office doesn't mean the bill in the article was more beneficial to the resistance than if the reps pushing it had been playing a game of backgammon.
You're right, let's wait for the horses to bolt to bar the barn doors. Luckily, passing legislature is a super quick and easy thing, so once the crisis is in full swing and not just the extensive rollbacks of LGBT protections current happening, we'll be able to comfortably slot the bill.
No legislation for LGBT rights is gonna pass either way, so the timing for pushing it is a moot point.
Settle in for the long fucking haul. Build plans. Build the basis for plans. Build the basis for the fucking basis.
Can I have that while defending the people currently being kidnapped and sent to God knows where (or to God directly)? The basis for the basis should be defending the people being persecuted now, not drawing a line in the sand that the administration is going to sprint over. Challenge what the fascists are doing now rather than hppe you'll be able to challenge them later. I hope I don't need to quote the poem.
Well they’re many things, but laws and procedures that will be useful in the sense you described need to be ones the regime either wants to stay in place or doesn’t care enough to notice. The bill in the article is neither.
That's not how government procedures in totalitarian states work.
The masses are already (to an extent) riled; what they need now is leadership so their energy can be spent on productive acts of resistance rather than a weekend protest every two weeks.
That you think the issue is a lack of leadership is... not realistic.
And there the question becomes: Who cares? Their office is now meaningless
Not even close. "The legislative branch won't save us from fascism" and "The legislative branch retains influence to hinder fascism" are not mutually exclusive positions.
No legislation for LGBT rights is gonna pass either way, so the timing for pushing it is a moot point.
Then why the fuck did you bring up the timing of pushing it?
Can I have that while defending the people currently being kidnapped and sent to God knows where (or to God directly)?
You can. But there might be symbolic legislative action being put forward while you do it, horror of horrors.
The basis for the basis should be defending the people being persecuted now, not drawing a line in the sand that the administration is going to sprint over. Challenge what the fascists are doing now rather than hppe you’ll be able to challenge them later. I hope I don’t need to quote the poem.
No, the basis for the basis is getting fucking organized. You may notice that there are people standing up and speaking, quite prominently. The issue is not that no one is speaking for the people who are being fucking disappeared by the secret police; the issue is that there is currently no serious power base or appetite for serious action in the general population with which to fucking stop them, in large part because left-purists decided to sign over all levers of government to the fascist regime without any fucking ground game to challenge it when it rolled into possession of one of the most powerful states in the fucking world.
Not even close. "The legislative branch won't save us from fascism" and "The legislative branch retains influence to hinder fascism" are not mutually exclusive positions.
Influence like? Without Republican defectors I mean.
Then why the fuck did you bring up the timing of pushing it?
Because now it's not making even a statement. You can prepare ahead of time, but you can't make a statement ahead of time that's not how that works. Pro-LGBT bill later = pro-immigrant bill now = at least making a statement. Pro-LGBT bill now = not even making a statement.
You can. But there might be symbolic legislative action being put forward while you do it, horror of horrors.
I'm sure as hell not gonna complain if they do both things, but they're not. Setting aside a few exceptions I'm not hearing a goddamn peep.
No, the basis for the basis is getting fucking organized.
Of course; my point is that politicians in federal officr can (and therefore should) be prompting the people to organize. Right now they're complicit in maintaining the wider population's sense of normalcy (see: People being surprised that ICE is robbing citizens). The onus is still on the people themselves to get organized, but everyone with a literal or metaphorical microphone should be screaming that 24/7 so they get their heads out of the gutter. Maybe it'll work, maybe it won't, but either way their silence accomplishes nothing.
You may notice that there are people standing up and speaking, quite prominently.
Yes, and there should he more of them. Again, the problem is the general sense of normalcy. Americans don't understand that they're in a time of crisis and think things will return to normal eventually, and everyone who can must take part in shattering that illusion. Again, even if it ultimately doesn't work, that doesn't excuse not trying.
its more like senator warren introducing the flag legislation which was meaniningless.
Turns out that when they actually get a majority, they need to reintroduce and actually vote for bills, or they lose credibility.
Which is how you get people who realized in 2021 that your party is run by useless bums who only effectively represent the businesses exploiting us and of course netanyahu.
You want less cynicism, inspire less cynicism.
who the fuck was saying that other than your fellow coward-ass liberals?
The same kinds of Very Serious Leftists who are now saying spontaneous revolutionary action is the only solution that is acceptable.
no lmao
If I had a nickel for every time a congressperson told me they introduced a new bill to address some issue, I’d be rich. In the age of Trump, people aren’t hoping their representatives are going to introduce dead on arrival legislation; they’re hoping their representatives will lead a national movement. We need people in the streets daily. We need occupy DC.
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