871
Billionaires Are Lying Shamelessly to Convince Us To Destroy Our Government
(www.currentaffairs.org)
this post was submitted on 03 Dec 2024
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The founders would routinely rape their slaves and participated in scalping. They were day drunk all the time because one of the best ways to clean water was to make it into beer. They didn't believe in bathing, they thought washing the grime off would let the bad airs in and make them sick.
I need to take issue with this part because that is simply not how things worked. The ale that was being made at the time (and had been made and drunk by people for centuries before then) instead of water had an extremely low alcohol content. Even a small child would have to drink a LOT to get tipsy.
It was generally drunk the day after it was brewed, so it didn't really have ages to ferment into a potent alcoholic drink. People did drink to get drunk, of course, but drinking small ale/small beer rather than water was not how they did it.
Largely irrelevant, if true.
It's not irrelevant. They're saying that the people you hold up as some kind of supremely enlightened few of a special era, were in fact products of their time who believed in a lot of silly things with no basis in science/reality, and committed many atrocities themselves.
I was a die-hard libertarian when I was 18. Then I learned a lot more about how the government actually functions. The more you know, the more painfully obvious it becomes that, not only is democratic government extremely necessary to support a civilization of our size, but also that uncoordinated government is literally impossible at scale. Try to lead a group of 20+ people in any activity and the importance of coordinated leadership will become evident very quickly.
The government that I am a part of, the society that I am a part of, actually has a problem with rape, torture, and murder. We even have a hard time, as a culture, with capital punishment. That doesn't mean that we don't do it but it's a point of contention.
What you're engaging with is known as the "association fallacy". Here's some homework for you, have fun. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Association_fallacy
No.. I'm not. Governing people and leading people are the same thing. I'm referencing doing it at two different scales. As you go up in scale, the rules change. Things like authoritarianism, socialism, libertarianism and communism work for small groups of people, but not when you start getting into populations in the millions.
Are you sure about that?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enhanced_interrogation_techniques https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sterilization_of_Native_American_women https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lists_of_killings_by_law_enforcement_officers_in_the_United_States https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Misogyny_and_mass_media https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capital_punishment_in_the_United_States#Public_opinion
Fairly certain, yeah.
Then why is the government you're a part of, and the society you're a part of, continuing to perpetuate rape, torture and murder?
It's socially unacceptable and illegal to do all three.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enhanced_interrogation_techniques https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sterilization_of_Native_American_women https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lists_of_killings_by_law_enforcement_officers_in_the_United_States https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Misogyny_and_mass_media https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capital_punishment_in_the_United_States#Public_opinion
Make your point without posting links.
The government you're a part of, and the society you're a part of, continues to perpetuate rape, torture and murder, despite on paper being illegal and, in polite company, being generally considered unacceptable - as shown by the links previously posted, which detail instances of state-sanctioned torture, murder, societal misogyny, et cetera. That's my point.
“If true” hooooooly shit you just live in a different reality, huh.
Well, you made a blanket statement.
Where do you think Jefferson's Black descendents come from? Who do you think paid the bounties for scalps? Germ theory wasn't invented yet, they didn't know why beer was safe to drink or why they needed to bathe. Settlers thought it was strange how the natives would strip naked and bathe in rivers - so uncivilized! Unlike Europeans, who would bathe as little as possible as to preserve their modesty.
All of this is easily looked up.
Your idols were evil morons. Read a history book.
Literally just spreading grade-school level misinfo because you never progressed past that level of understanding of history, lmao.
I say "if true" and you immediately conflate this to "it's not true".
You people wouldn't survive outside of your echo chamber, I'm sure that's why you're here. There's no room for independent thought, nuance, or critical thinking. You repeate a narrative and jack each other off all day, it's disgusting.
Ah yes, the independent thought and nuance of repeating the propaganda fed to you by your own government. You're such a free thinker!
I recommend reading Lies My Teacher Told Me. Then, when you finish that, A People's History of the United States.
But I doubt you've ever read even one history book that wasn't assigned to you by a teacher.
lmao, imagine seriously recommending either.
Try reading these "I'm 14 and this is deep" pop-history books to get on my level.
You seem so sure of your assumptions as you mock me as a free thinker. How rich.
I can't help but notice you didn't deny it.
I don't need to, you made the claim, burden of proof is on you and I couldn't give a shit less what you think. It's just so amusing watching you behave exactly as I've come to expect from this community.
I literally gave you books as citations.
But you don't read books, so I'll give you Wikipedia.
Jefferson has Black descendents and had a Black "mistress" who was, in actuality, his slave. Her name was Sarah Hemings.
During the Revolution, the Sullivan Expedition was ordered by George Washington to wipe out Iroquois villages that sided with the British. Scalping was widely practiced.
Bathing letting in bad airs is known as miasma theory. It was widely practiced all across Europe, from peasants to merchants to royalty. Tribes like the Wampanoag noted how fucking nasty they all smelled.
No Wikipedia for this one, but https://www.grunge.com/591432/the-staggering-amount-of-alcohol-the-founding-fathers-drank/
Now, how about you learn some history?
Look, I don't care. It's irrelevant to my point if they were bad people. The only reason I brought up the founders was to say even they, who stood up a government, didn't trust the government.
🤡
You say "even they" as if it justifies your beliefs, because they agree with you. Libertarianism grew from their classical liberalism. So what? Their ideas were shit.
Even the people who set this government up don't trust government. Given the same opportunity, most people who would set a government up would do so trusting only the government and not the people.
How is that so hard for you understand?
They didn't trust the government because they were rich people and didn't want a democratic check on their own personal power.