noretus

Same, actually. Which is why I meditate after being up for a while and/or in the evening.

Weird only to a mind that's used to being constantly bombarded with low quality entertainment, lulled into comfortable numbness with mostly unnecessary material goods. While this is overly extreme (and potentially hazardous... though that being 4chan it's probably exaggerated, if even true), most people would do well to take periods of disconnecting entirely and have minimal entertainment available. Zen Buddhist retreats are great by my experience. Yoga Retreats are nice but you need to weed out the ones that are really just masturbatory Wellness holidays for rich white women. Vipassana retreats are probably good too tho I personally haven't been to one of those. But just starting meditation would be great. https://www.wakingup.com/ is a low bar access point with guided meditations but also a lot of great philosophical discussions from several different branches of thought (notably Stoicism and Buddhism but others too). And you can get it for free (request scholarship) if the price seems steep.

For one thing: [email protected]

For second thing: Conscious Consumerism.

For third thing: if you have money to burn on a stupid novelty t-shirt featuring things you specifically don't like, maybe rather donate it to something you actually value.

Ah, I didn't see this post.

https://bsky.app/profile/saelliott.bsky.social/post/3ljxf6ou6l22a btw for the post on Bsky.

That's fucking great news. If there ever was a time I wish Finland copied something from Sweden, this is it.

Level. Allow German, French and Spanish. You should be able to get mods that speak at least one of those languages. And I'm saying this as someone who speaks none of those. But I think it would be good if English didn't have such a dominance. Might even motivate people to learn one.

Yeah, Unilever isn't much greater either. In general trying to go for local, smaller brands would be good IF you can afford it. Of course a lot of people have to go by what is cheapest and most available and that's their right. But now if ever, if someone is resourced enough, it would be good to spend some time on at least taking a look at the brands they have available in their regular grocery stores and try to make responsible choices.

(As someone who has been doing this for a long time, and is low income, it's a bit of an unrewarding pain in the ass but at least I don't have that nagging feeling at the back of my head as much)

Thankfully it seems like EU is at least trying to be stricter about conscious consumer labels etc, limiting green-washing and all that. That makes life a bit easier for those who very understandably don't have tons of time and energy to research every purchase.

They are just trying to align everything that's being said to their previously held beliefs. People aren't typically all that aware of what their core beliefs are because an alternative, challenging core belief would have to breach all the way into it for it them to realize they have one. Without the salient contrast, they just don't notice it's there. It's just blue against a blue background, and unless a yellow comes along, they're not going to realize there's anything there. The materialistic worldview is so prevalent that a random online conversation isn't likely to get through, no matter how well argued. I've had similar discussions many times and sooner or later people just kind of "reset" and I find myself having to say the same things again and again because there's just this impenetrable thought loop going on. Logic doesn't breach it, it's just that they keep asking for all the different ways we can reach the number 42. If I tell them 41+1=42, they ask again and I have to try to explain how 40+2 is also 42, and so on ad nauseum. "Hahaa, but there's a 33-4347+132562+767368, I bet you can't do anything to get that to 42". That can be done all day. If the person isn't truly open for new ways to think (and few people in these type of settings are), as in they aren't actively looking for it with an open curiosity, it's not likely they'll realize much during that convo.

It's really, really, natural and normal. I just thought it was funny because OP is behaving the exact same way they're asking about in their initial post. They'll probably eventually figure it out.

You said that you don't know for sure if it's matter or consciousness that comes first but everything you're saying hinges on you very firmly believing that matter is prior.

If you had genuine uncertainty about it, you would be much more careful about how you go about asking for proof. If you weren't sure that matter is prior, it would occur to you to question what "objective" and "subjective" means. I could also ask you, can you step outside consciousness and objectively prove to me that your matter exists? If not, why do you value objective over subjective so much?

So to round back to your initial question: you can intellectually acknowledge the difficulty of proving matter vs. consciousness, yet if we probe it, clearly you hold a firm belief about it despite not being able to rationally prove your belief. So you can ask your initial question from yourself now. Despite your reasoning skill, why aren't you more skeptical about the materialist view AND it's implications?

Sure, many people do that kind of a dance or compartmentalization. But that only lasts as long as nothing severe comes to challenge it. Sudden death of a loved one is a cliche but commonly forces people to conclude something.

For me, I get that logic too is just models that predict things. Backwards or forwards. But it doesn't answer what anything is. You can only EXPERIENCE what something is, but you can never accurately represent it. Because the moment you try to represent an experience, it's not the experience itself, just a representation. So logical conclusion is that the only way to know something for sure, is to experience it as it is before any representation.

People with religious experiences may get to the ineffable truth but then they get enamored by their own attempts to represent it. They focus on the representation, instead of the experience, and they start to insist that their representation is the bestest and most correctest - because everything in their head aligns to it. Then it just becomes a matter of who has the most charismatic foghorns and the most appealing representation. Which has a very reasonable logic of it's own, as far as it goes.