this post was submitted on 13 Nov 2024

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Manstrual cycles (lemmy.ca)

submitted 2 days ago* (last edited 1 day ago) by [email protected] to c/[email protected]

162 comments fedilink hide all child comments

There are downsides with downloading their app just to input bad data, but it's a fun thought.

edit: While we're at it we might as well offer an alternative app to people.

I posted in [email protected] to collect recommendations for better apps

The post: https://lemmy.ca/post/32877620

Leading Recommendation from the comments

The leading recommendation seems to be Drip (bloodyhealth.gitlab.io)

Summarizing what people shared:

accessible: it is on F-droid, Google Play, & iOS App Store
does not allow any third-party tracking
the project got support from "PrototypeFund & Germany's Federal Ministry of Education and Research, the Superrr Lab and Mozilla"
Listed features:
- "Your data, your choice: Everything you enter stays on your device"
- "Not another cute, pink app: drip is designed with gender inclusivity in mind."
- "Your body is not a black box: drip is transparent in its calculations and encourages you to think for yourself."
- "Track what you like: Just your period, or detect your fertility using the symptothermal method."

Their Mastodon: https://mastodon.social/@dripapp

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[–] [email protected] 1 points 12 hours ago* (last edited 12 hours ago)

Finally, now these zesty, emotional, chuds have an excuse for their emotional behavior.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 13 hours ago

Menstrual cycles are so last millennium, I was told there would be menstrual hovercraft by now.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 13 hours ago

Fellas, fellas! I'm preggers! 🥳

I fear it might not last the weekend tho.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 15 hours ago

Will it work if I do this from Canada? I haven't had a period in over 4 years (help, I've been pregnant for 4 years!) But I want to help y'all too!

[–] [email protected] 3 points 17 hours ago* (last edited 17 hours ago) (3 children)

I am doing my part. Don't really know what I am doing, just happy to br a part of it.

Edit. Is this normal? Just presse at random

[–] [email protected] 2 points 12 hours ago* (last edited 12 hours ago)

I think it would be easy for them to filter extremely atypical period patterns - usually you aren’t go to have a one day period. In between spotting is something you talk to a doctor about. Two a month would be awful.

Realistically, think about 4-7 days. Regular cycles, one a month. Usually about the same amount of time between each. To really fake the data, log intensity. Starts with spotting, usually intensifies in the middle, then slows down again. (To be really extra, log some clots lol)

The best way to help would be to pollute the data set with as many fake pregnancies as possible. Log regularly, take a break for about three months, then log another to simulation an abortion or miscarriage.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 15 hours ago (1 children)

I think this app is a poop tracker. Tick the days your poops take an extra flush, and then also the days you get a clean release. That should help you track your bowel movements effectively. You're welcome.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 13 hours ago

I use mine entirely differently. Now that we're into November it's been quiet.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 16 hours ago

Oil moment /s

[–] [email protected] 8 points 1 day ago (2 children)

Why are such apps popular? Do these offer something more than what a combination of reminders and notes (digital or analog) providr?

Perhaps, these apps offer some insights based on the data. But would one take the risk of listening to an app for medical advice?

[–] [email protected] 16 points 17 hours ago (2 children)

Hi! Lots of people in this comment section who clearly don't have periods, but yea they do offer something more. That's why they're used. It really feels like a bunch of presumably men are here in the comments to remind women that paper exists? Yea, we know. Other than these all being easily searchable questions, allow me to say we use them for many reasons including: Convenience - you almost always have your phone on hand. Do you really want to keep a dedicated period journal on your person at all times? Predictions - despite what you may believe, periods are not all regular. Some can skip months at a time. Most apps have a bunch of data sets they use to predict things even if your data isn't complete Integrations - does my journal automatically cross reference my symptoms and alert me that it noticed that eating apples makes my headaches worse? No, and the level of analysis being done would need both an inhuman amount of time and resources to do by hand

Women are not "listening to an app for medical advice" so much as using apps predictive algorithm. The app has access to much more data than we do individually and it can be extremely helpful for women with irregular or extreme periods.

Is it great opsec? No. Sometimes things trump (lol) opsec. I still will advise against anyone (man or woman) downloading and using these apps if they have alternatives. The apple health app seems like a privacy focused one, but I can't stress enough how none of that matters anyway. The courts and public opinion will be stacked against women in these positions, so any app data that can be used will be, and any lack of app data will just be used to make the case anyway. Keep as much data as you can as private as you can, regardless. People adding false data to the does nothing.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 8 hours ago (1 children)

Thank you for providing detailed answers to my questions; which is what they are, just questions. I want to clarify, as much as your response suggests, I had not accused anyone or the apps of anything, nor was I belittling anyone for not knowing "paper exists". But I do get your frustrations which such comments, mine included.

I just want to better understand the appeal of these apps – all health tracking apps for that matter, and not just period trackers.

I still feel using such apps was a bad idea even before the onset of the current cultural and political climate, despite the convenience offered.

We have been consulting actual doctors long before these apps appeared on the scene, who provide personalised advice without the risks of large-scale data tracking, whether it is for something as simple as a prolonged cold or as complicated as delayed periods.

P.S. Yes, these are easily searchable questions, but then there is never a need to have any discussion on a forum as everything is a search away. I figured a more direct conversation would give me a clearer sense of the actual user experience, especially given how nuanced such issues can be.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 2 hours ago

Thank you for not taking any offense to my frustrated tone, as it was indeed just that, frustration. Having questions and posting them here is completely understandable, and for what it's worth, I'd rather people ask than just never get an answer.

Though you are allowed to have your own opinion and come to your own conclusions, I think the fact you stated that you think using the apps was a bad idea even before now, and that doctors have been helping people long before apps, demonstrates that either I was not clear enough, or you were unable to appreciate the lived experience of people affected by their periods.

Doctors regularly misunderstand, misdiagnose, and outright ignore period related medical issues. I'm not sure where you live, but even in a country with the best healthcare in the world, it's literally impossible for doctors to provide the personalized information that apps can. I'm not saying that apps therefore must be used and are better than doctors, but I, a woman with periods, am telling you that my app has been more helpful than my doctor as far as managing my cycle goes. You don't have to believe me, or you can say that you don't think anything is worth the trade off in data for you as an individual, but people using these apps would obviously disagree. And not just because they don't know they're being tracked. We're all being tracked to a certain extent and we decide what we're willing to put up with in exchange. If you don't think you'd share your data for that convenience, fine, but people share data for other conveniences all the time. It's just extremely unfortunate that this data has now become so contentious.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 15 hours ago (1 children)

Here's how I think about it:

I deleted Samsung Health from my phone not long after getting it. I started realizing that it's a VERY network intensive app, it wanted a lot of questionable permissions, etc. I fully see the purpose of a Health & Fitness app in the lives of everyday people, I think it can be of legitimate help for encouraging people to exercise and whatever, the health features of that app were definitely developed with the same attitude a hunter baits a trap. It was what they begrudgingly did to get me to step in it.

I ditched Samsung Health because I had visions of them selling that data to my health insurance provider who would then use it as an excuse to make my coverage worse and therefore more profitable. So I'm pretty sure if I was a jew in 1930's Germany I'd delete Synogogr from my phone.

Elsewhere, I've seen women tweet or Tumbl or whatever about refusing to discuss their periods with their doctors. "When was yoru last period?" "It's regular, that's all you need to know." Where's that energy when it's a cell phone app?

[–] [email protected] 1 points 3 hours ago

I think it was probably a good move to stop using Samsung health. Hopefully you're getting the features you need elsewhere or are staying healthy without it.

I think you are seeing some of that energy as it relates to these apps, hence the OOP, but for practicality sake, and maybe out of naivety, most women are not/don't need to be as concerned as Jews in 1930s Germany. Most of the harm that will be done will be in removing access to future care and likely mainly to start in red states. If apps become a huge source of the issue, I think you'll see a larger shift, but I imagine most of those cases would not need app data as a main source of evidence. You'll see women dying of miscarriages more and more. And abortion will be more difficult to access, but I think there would have to be more cases where period app data was specifically used to convict before much changes. I think it's difficult to accurately convey how important accurate tracking/predictions can be for some people, and how unwilling they would be to give that up. Especially if they are not in a situation where they are likely to get pregnant. The difference between telling your doctor your period is regular vs using an app is that your doctor is just not capable of giving up to the minute personalized information the way an app can. If people's doctors were personally knocking on their door reminding them to take their medication twice a day and then giving them reminders that Wednesdays their symptoms are worse so maybe don't plan a full body gym workout, they'd probably be less likely to withhold the information from their doctor, so I don't really see the two as being directly comparable. Though, I generally agree with the sentiment that it's bad idea to trust anyone with your data, especially health data or data that can be used to support a criminal case against you.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 1 day ago

Yeah, the only way anyone should have ever trusted these is if the data was stored locally only. There's no reason for it to be uploaded.

[–] [email protected] 11 points 1 day ago (3 children)

Why in the world do we even need apps for this stuff? There is no reason to give your data to these companies at all.

Here's a crazy thought: get a journal. And write in it.

[–] [email protected] 16 points 18 hours ago (1 children)

I don't know if you're someone who's not had to deal with menstrual cycles, but that's not really helpful advice. Apps provide a lot of useful information and often integrate with other health data to offer better predictions and general insights. Many cycles are not "oh, it's the 15th, here we go". Many can be affected or predicted by mood/diet/symptoms. That's a lot for a person to keep track of. My app will sometimes predict up to a 3 day shift and be completely accurate. I have looked at the graphs and sometimes you can point to a specific symptom and say, oh that must be what it used for that prediction, but sometimes you can't. Get stressed every year around the holidays to the point where it changes your cycle? Your app will remember that. One less thing for your stressed mind to worry about. Additionally, even if they were super regular to the day, having an app to send a reminder, "hey! Get ready tomorrow" can be helpful to make sure you have any supplies you may need.

Also, we use apps for things we don't need to all the time. And generally, it's for the same reason: apps are easier and more accessible. Since you mentioned a journal, there are plenty of apps out there that replace journals themselves. They are used for several reasons, but one would imagine using an app is easier because it's not an extra item you have to have on you and can potentially lose or forget to bring, it's always on you so the resistance barrier is smaller, it might even have search functionality.

Do I think people should be randomly downloading these apps? No, it really doesn't do anything at all. But blaming people for using conveniences because the government is trying to take away their rights is really missing the mark. It might be good opsec, but it's dismissive at the least and not really solving the actual problem.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 13 hours ago* (last edited 13 hours ago) (1 children)

What a goddamn comment. Informative, thoughtful, and an amazing rebuttal without being condescending. Is best of a thing on here?

[–] [email protected] 1 points 3 hours ago

Provided I'm not missing sarcasm here, that's nice of you to say, but honestly I certainly hope it wouldn't be relevant in a best of. Lemmy is full of really helpful people in niche communities sharing their expertise, so I'd hope explaining why people use apps would be seen as out of place in a best of lol. Thank you regardless.

[–] [email protected] -3 points 1 day ago

Based

[–] [email protected] 6 points 1 day ago

The absolute madlad

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