this post was submitted on 11 Nov 2024
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FediLore + Fedidrama

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Chronicle the life and tale of the fediverse (+ matrix)

Largely a sublemmy about capturing drama, from fediverse spanning drama to just lemmy drama.

Includes lore like how a instance got it's name, how an instance got defederated, how an admin got doxxed, fedihistory etc

(New) This sub's intentions is to an archive/newspaper, as in preferably don't get into fights with each other or the ppl featured in the drama

Tags: fediverse news, lemmy news, lemmyverse

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Yesterday, an unexpected admin post was made announcing that hexbear would be shutting down and recreating two of their most popular communities: the_dunk_tank and dredge_tank. For those who are not aware, those two are some of the most notorious comms in the threadiverse which routinely cause inter-lemmy drama (disclaimer, the deteriorating relations between our instance and hexbear and my own ban from hexbear was ultimately triggered by various posts in the_dunk_tank)

The stated reason was to promote more thoughtful discussions and to prevent a white cishet mindset which was apparently promoted by the content in those comms, according to the mods and admins.

Within a day 1.3 thousand comments were made with hexbear regulars upset at this decision and discussing within.

However, before this announcement, the top admin of hexbear posted in the cross-lemmy admin matrix chat urging other admins to close down their "drama communities" as well.

Hexbears caught wind of this and quickly accused the admin of duplicity, and having other motives instead of their stated ones. The admin in question as defense admitted that it was their attempt to manipulate other lemmy instance admins and it backfired on them

After a whole day of this, the main admin decided to step away from hexbear , followed by more resignations

In the midst of this, people realize another old-mod had recently come back after a 3-year hiatus, and now people start suspecting some correlation. That mod makes a public post before shortly after deleting their account.

There's also smaller pieces of chaos ongoing, such as one admin, banning one of their alts "as a bit" using wording that they were not aware is misgendering ("fella") which caused other hexbears to pile on. Eventually that was resolved, and admins are asked to tone down the "bit doing" during this heated period.

This "struggle session" is still ongoing, with people are asking the resigned mod to come back, and other admins unbanning accounts which were getting banned left and right but it seems those popular comms still remain shut down.

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[–] [email protected] 0 points 4 days ago* (last edited 4 days ago) (14 children)

Speaking personally, them stating they outright lied to other instance admins is just one step too much. Wielding our collaborative spirit for manipulative purposes just sows distrust, and is downright asocial behaviour. It's so out of line, that I honestly don't believe they actually lied. I think they were being earnest and only claimed they were being manipulative when caught by hexbears to save face. But if not, that's even worse.

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[–] [email protected] 0 points 4 days ago (1 children)

What in the Open-source-Zuckerberg-hating hell is the "Threadiverse"?

[–] [email protected] 0 points 4 days ago* (last edited 4 days ago) (1 children)

Portmanteau of "Threads" and "Fediverse" (which is itself a portmanteau of "Federated Universe"). Effectively "Threaded discussions Fediverse".

[–] [email protected] 0 points 4 days ago (1 children)

But why rebrand it? It already was the Fediverse. Just because Meta decided to start its own instance, we're now rebranding it for them? Fuck that. Threads is not even playing by the same rules. They basically just took the activity pub protocol and made their own closed source clone.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 4 days ago* (last edited 4 days ago) (2 children)

Threadiverse is a subgroup of Fediverse. It's just a way to say Lemmy + Mbin + Piefed, without saying just "Lemmy" or all the three every time. It has nothing to do with Meta and it existed before they created threads.net

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[–] [email protected] 0 points 4 days ago

The hexbear folks can have their clownshow, just keep it in the clowncar. Sounds like the drivers are tripping balls and the clowncar needs some maintenance.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 4 days ago (2 children)

I cannot, for the life of me, understand what the appeal of all of this is.

I think it's the same hunger for excitement that makes sports appeal to people, or leads people to create drama at work.

That was a ruse in an attempt to get the other admins to close their drama communities like the ones that harassed vegantheoryclub admins but I did not expect the hexbear sleuths to find that so not only did the ruse fail but I blew up any chance of doing another in the future with other lemmy admins while further alienating hexbear users.

It blows my mind that they thought this would work.

Hexbear users are alienated because they enjoy being annoying. That's it. That's the secret. They can always stop doing that, that's always allowed. Being dishonest isn't great, but there are a lot of people in authority on Lemmy that are dishonest, and it's mostly not a problem.

I also like the implication that it was the unmasking of the ruse that made it not work, instead of the fact that this is the stupidest ruse I've ever heard of.

Eventually that was resolved, and admins are asked to tone down the “bit doing” during this heated period.

Not in general, of course. It's only a problem right now during this heated period. I wonder what some other "bits" are.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 4 days ago* (last edited 4 days ago)

I wonder what some other “bits” are.

Like a lot of other insular online communities, the humor has gone through multiple levels of "deep frying" that it becomes almost alien to an ousider looking in.

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[–] [email protected] 0 points 4 days ago (1 children)

To this day, the only instance I have in my blocked list.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 4 days ago

I have others blocked, only a couple because of bad user or mod behavior. Most haven't done anything wrong, they're just in languages I don't speak and it was filling my feed with posts I couldn't read, lol.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 4 days ago

Asking resigned mod to come back.

134 votes. 😳

[–] [email protected] 0 points 4 days ago (7 children)

Honestly I think this speaks to the value of having user-level blocking of instances rather than defederation. Maybe one day that will be incorporated into Lemmy (or similar).

[–] [email protected] 0 points 4 days ago (1 children)

You can do it now in PieFed, or some apps like Sync or Connect. Otherwise you can only block communities but not all users from an instance, short of becoming an admin yourself or moving to one that has done what you wanted to see done. More details in [email protected].

I doubt we'll ever see it in Lemmy proper, especially as the protections that were offered in the past took so long to arrive and then were subsequently rolled back to become weaker - it's just not a priority for the admins who constantly ban others at the drop of a hat, but don't seem to want to build tools that allow the reverse.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 4 days ago (1 children)

I had no idea that was built into piefed, that's great!

App-based is... Not great IMO, it needs to be part of the base or its just not viable.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 4 days ago (5 children)

Yeah PieFed lacks a lot of basic polish (e.g. neither user tagging like @[email protected] nor a post/comment preview ability have been implemented yet) while on the other hand there are so many cool features that already exist, above and beyond what Lemmy offers (like custom blocking of all users on an instance, and categories of communities helping guide new users into subscriptions). Plus with it being written in Python rather than Rust it should catch up fairly quickly in what it does lack, even though again in other ways it's already ahead.

Also I've noticed that I am almost never downvoted (maybe once or twice on >400 comments so far) since I switched. It's highly relevant that unlike my previous instance discuss.online and before that startrek.website, piefed.social has defederated entirely from hexbear.net. People have even commented like "I'm sorry you are getting piled on", but I have to go to another instance to even see it. It's fucking beautiful 😍 - PieFed actually offers the ability to block spam while accessing Lemmy content!!! ❤️

[–] [email protected] 0 points 4 days ago (4 children)

Well to be fair, hexbears cannot downvote you anyway since they have them disabled instance-wide

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[–] [email protected] 0 points 4 days ago (2 children)

Honestly, this online "revolutionary" shit is really starting to give SLA vibes. When I joined lemmy, I really gave them a chance, even though I'm strictly against authoritarianism of any stripe. I eventually blocked the instance, not because of negative interactions, but because my feed would be filled with their shit talking communities and all the comments were just gigantic emojis. It was just out of control shit posting.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 4 days ago (1 children)

Tbf the emojis being giant was due to them running a modified version of Lemmy that allowed those but to themselves they appeared smaller (iirc?).

Though I definitely blocked the instance for those other two reasons - the toxicity of interactions and low quality of posts and comments.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 4 days ago (1 children)

That almost sounds like it's intentionally disruptive to other instances of it is normal size to them, but large to everyone else.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 4 days ago (2 children)

Nah for most of their history they didn't federated with anyone, and made some custom changes to the software. So when they did federated there were a few issues like that

[–] [email protected] 0 points 4 days ago

Ah, I see. God to hear that wasn't intentional.

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[–] [email protected] 0 points 4 days ago (1 children)

"SLA"? Service Level Agreement?

[–] [email protected] 0 points 4 days ago (1 children)
[–] [email protected] 0 points 4 days ago* (last edited 4 days ago) (3 children)

Ha, that's like the US version of RAF. Also that name sounds like straight out of Disco Elysium :D

[–] [email protected] 0 points 4 days ago

It's a made-up nonsense word, lol. They really were some clowns, too. They were predominantly white, with the exception of one black and one Latino member, but they would try to pretend like they were black by "speaking like black people" because they had taken an AAVE class in college. Deranged behavior.

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[–] [email protected] 0 points 4 days ago

I’m so glad I don’t have to see their BS. Very happy being defederated.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 4 days ago
[–] [email protected] 0 points 4 days ago (1 children)

I don't know enough about Hexbear, my interactions with them in the communities I go to have been overwhelmingly positive. But I recognise the toxicity elsewhere. That said, the moderators and admins here were clearly on the right side and tried to make positive changes. It's a shame there's opposition to that.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 4 days ago (2 children)

Of course the members of an extremist echochamber tend to usually be friendly towards each other. Makes it even more amusing when we see all hell breaking lose and the masks coming off.

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[–] [email protected] 0 points 4 days ago (1 children)

I wanted to block their instance before it was possible in Lemmy, but thankfully my instance admin did. Nothing I've ever seen from them made me want to interact with them.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 4 days ago

The users act like children so makes sense a nsfw instance would defed it.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 4 days ago* (last edited 4 days ago) (7 children)

Interestingly, some Hexbear users accused the francophone instance jlai.lu to be authoritarian when it opened a discussion, and a poll for the community to vote about defederating from Hexbear (a final decision has yet to be made).

Then an Hexbear admin unilaterally decided to defederate from jlai.lu claiming it had "reactionary" users and "no effort was made to address this" (no jlai.lu admin was contacted nor prompted about the existence of such users).

Then this happens, again with complete disregard for the community members.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 4 days ago (2 children)

It's interesting that they would accuse anyone if being authoritarian when their own ideology is distinctly authoritarian.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 4 days ago

Hexbear users are stupid enough to think that way.

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[–] [email protected] 0 points 4 days ago

Then an Hexbear admin unilaterally decided to defederate from jlai.lu claiming it had "reactionary" users and "no effort was made to address this" (no jlai.lu admin was contacted nor prompted about the existence of such users).

This is funny because it sort of mimics Russian, Chinese or North Korean politics to a degree as well. Everyone's authoritarian, fascists, Nazis - except for them, the beacon of democracy, freedom, and values.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 4 days ago (10 children)

They did exactly the same thing with Lemmy.nz, threw a shit fit and defederated, after a certain someone made a post suggesting we defederate them.

It was a very "you can't fire me, I quit" thing.

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[–] [email protected] 0 points 4 days ago (1 children)

Ye, this thing keep happening. I was recently in a discussion where someone was accusing slrpnk of authoritarianism for blocking hexbear immediately and pointing to the various defed threads on hexbear and arguing therefore that hexbear is the example to follow for democratic decision taking.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 4 days ago* (last edited 4 days ago) (2 children)

Slrpnk, the instance full of hippies and anarchists, is authoritarian? Lol how do they come up with this shit

[–] [email protected] 0 points 4 days ago

It’s so funny coming from Hexbear users who simp for Putin and Xi

[–] [email protected] 0 points 4 days ago* (last edited 4 days ago)

Because they blocked hexbear without a vote apparently.

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