this post was submitted on 13 Sep 2024
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Aside from racism. I mean economically/socially, what issues does too much immigration cause?

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[–] [email protected] 0 points 2 months ago

Many companies love undocumented workers. Easy to abuse, underpay, overwork. So of course they hate it when those workers can easily get documented or citizenship. Following the law is such an annoyance. Cuts into the profit margin. That is why big business and the nationalists often work together.

The nationalists kinda know they're getting played to generate corporate profits, but they also enjoy having a target to look down on.

[–] [email protected] 9 points 2 months ago

From an economic perspective, it's mostly positive. Raising a child is expensive, and those costs go on for about 20 years before you have a person that's economically productive. Most Immigrants are adults and can join the workforce immediately. The economic costs of their childhood was paid by the country they came from. It's a negative for the country they came from, this is refereed to as a "brain drain." But for their new country, it's like a tax paying worker just appeared out of nowhere.

As for the economic negatives, the big one is housing. Too much immigration all at once can result in a shortage of housing. It can also put stress on public services and infrastructure. Businesses may not have the capacity to serve a larger population. These things can adapt of course, but you can't instantly build a house and you can't instantly expand public services, etc. So you might want to limit immigration so an area can adapt to all of the various economic needs of a larger population. An immigrant will work and pay taxes and contribute to the local economy, so long term it's all positives, but there can be a lot of short term problems if a population grows to rapidly.

As for social... well I'm not really much of a sociologist, but just from I can see, people who already live in an area might be uncomfortable being around people of a different culture. Might say crazy things like "They're eating the dogs!" Yeah that's crazy, but it is a problem. Not caused by the immigrants themselves, but it's a problem that does happen when there's immigration.

But there's social benefits. Can learn from a new culture. May get some new options for restaurants to go to.

Generally the young will enjoy more social benefit (going out to the different restaurants and learning about different cultures), but the older people will tend to be uncomfortable with it. But that's just the tendency.

So overall I'd say you do need limits on immigration to mitigate the short term issues, but it's all positives in the long term.

[–] [email protected] -1 points 2 months ago
[–] [email protected] 9 points 2 months ago

In my opinion, country-based immigration paired with needs-based works really well.

Ultimately, many of the best parts of the culture of a place are because of what people brought with them years ago. Some of the best restaurants are because someone in India moved to the UK, and then moved to the US and brought the culture of Curry Mile or Brick Lane with them, or because a community of Greek railroad workers decided to set up bakeries using their known recipes that all the locals love.

The same often goes for business. Look at the rise of Aldi and Lidl, and how cheap produce and great workers rights will suddenly make local supermarkets look in bewilderment at how markets they once dominated are being torn away from them.

IMO, if you have skills to offer, you should be welcome. I'm currently in the process of moving to the US on a high-skilled visa, and it is mad how one country will require thousands in legal fees and 24+ month waits while a country next door will say "Shit, you can teach?! Come join us! If you want to stay permanently that's fine!"

[–] [email protected] 6 points 2 months ago (1 children)

It's a complex and polarising issue. The main problem is that some, sometimes most, of immigrants don't want to assimilate. They are creating ghettos, don't respect local laws. Other issue is that governments prefer to spend tax payer money for accommodating immigrants instead of solving nation's issues.

I wouldn't limit immigration per se. I would limit unchecked illegal immigration and spend more money on assimilating immigrants that want to contribute to a country they moved into.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 2 months ago (1 children)

The main problem is that some, sometimes most, of immigrants don’t want to assimilate. They are creating ghettos, don’t respect local laws.

Generalisations like this are the very reason it's a polarising issue. Opinions like yours generally derive from "observation" and "gut feeling". Which by definition is completely anecdotal and harmful when it begins to be applied to millions of people all at once.

Betsy from insert town here sees an immigrant couple down the street in her home-town keeping to themselves and not really wanting to take part in the community. She's talking on the phone to nosy-nessie the town busybody who says "oh...you know...my aunt said the same thing about her insert culture neighbours." And then all of a sudden, that's just "how those people are"...all of them...everywhere.

Maybe this couple is just a little embarrassed about their english skills and want to strengthen them more before going into public everywhere, which comes across as shy. Maybe they're just private...who knows. But suddenly...."it's just how (those people) are", becomes the anecdotal "truth".

It's wrong, it's dangerous, and the fact that you don't even grasp the irony of your own comment is telling in a lot of ways.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 2 months ago (1 children)

No unfortunately. There is plenty of evidence of immigrants building their own justice systems and authorities under the radar of their new countries because it goes against the freedoms and expectations.

We shouldn't ignore that and not talk about it.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 2 months ago

Great. Then you shouldn't have any problem coming up with three examples for us all.

[–] [email protected] 11 points 2 months ago (2 children)

Aside from racism, it is usually the belief that the new immigrants will either be economic competition for those with jobs or a drain on welfare.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 2 months ago

in my country that's exactly what is happening, they are taking the simpler jobs for much cheaper, and lot of our "native" people has/had jobs like this.

ironically, this country is among the loudest in anti-immigration in the EU, all the while they are immigrating people from neighboring countries exactly for cheap labor.

[–] [email protected] 12 points 2 months ago (1 children)

That combined with a lack of available housing are the answers I see most often.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 2 months ago (1 children)

Gee, if only we could find the labor to build some extra housing. Must be that the immigrants taking our jobs just don't want to work these days.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 2 months ago (1 children)

You also need money, materials, and space to build housing though and I doubt all immigrants are carpenters, electricians, plumbers, and all the other professionals needed to build homes.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 2 months ago

Richest nation on earth, but only in stonks and bullets.

[–] [email protected] 18 points 2 months ago

It depends on the kind of immigrant. You have students, high educated workforce, people that flee from war/not safe to stay country and people that just want a (economic) better life.

I think too much of any immigration can cause maybe an issue that the majority of people are new and that the culture (how do we interact with each other, what is acceptable behavior etc) has not settled.

[–] [email protected] 10 points 2 months ago

The "shot in the foot" effect when you accept immigrants from conservative/racist countries and they and - most likely - the next generation will vote right wing which more accurately mirrors those conservative/racist beliefs.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 2 months ago (1 children)

There is no or a very small impact of regulation on the number of exiled people coming in country. However, making more people illegal let bosses exploit them more. Those workers could not sue their boss because of those regulations, and most conservative unions rely unfortunately too much on legal solutions.

So if a country couldn't limit immigrations, it could exploit more people and bybass human right with regulations against exiled people.

Yes, this is only positive for far-right bosses, and awful for others. But guess who decide in a capitalist economy ?

[–] [email protected] 3 points 2 months ago

Not sure why you were downvoted, but this is a good point. In fact, I find it interesting that the US hasn't stopped pretending and just lifted the law against hiring illegal immigrants.

It's the main argument on how to stop illegal immigration, no one seems to talk about. Instead of building walls, jailing people or even shooting them for crossing the border, they should crack down on the people who hire them. To me it's just conservatives admitting that their opinions are just racist.

Sorry if you the conversation was about Europe. Just relating it to home.

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