this post was submitted on 12 Jun 2024
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Political Memes

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[–] [email protected] 29 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago) (18 children)

Given the attitudes on this platform I'm bracing for the downvotes, but I genuinely wish you and others like you would stop trying to (nearly daily) insult/shame others into voting the way you want. You should watch this video by Bernie Sanders about winning votes for Biden on merit and logic. Note that he never uses insults, and the reasoned arguments Sanders has been making for months convinced me to stop telling people to vote 3rd party months ago. I'm now willing to ask people to vote Biden in spite of my reservations - not because Biden is great but because Trump absolutely cannot be allowed to win.

You and others with the same views could try that approach as opposed to reflexively calling everyone who brings up concerns or expresses reservations fascists, complete idiots, bots, and so on. I have no clue why so many people on Lemmy believe that incessantly attacking everyone who disagrees with them with the most extreme accusations they can muster makes their position welcoming or attractive. I won't speak for others but I was won over by calm reason, not being called slurs every time I opened Lemmy.

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[–] [email protected] -3 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago) (10 children)

Rather than smugly shaming leftists who draw the line at genocide, you could instead spend your time pushing Biden to stop the slaughter, which would instantly win votes. It's telling that you don't 😉

[–] [email protected] 6 points 5 months ago (28 children)

Another pro-Biden liberal trying to push leftists to vote for genocide. (They won’t, sorry)

Funny, last I checked the terminally online MLs were advocating letting Trump win and genocide flourish.

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[–] [email protected] 52 points 5 months ago (24 children)

I've never voted in an election where I wasn't voting for policies I disagree with.

These kids need better civics education so they know we don't get nice things in America.

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[–] [email protected] 38 points 5 months ago

The MAGA had slowly coming into view *chefs kiss *

[–] [email protected] 114 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago) (50 children)

voting 3rd party

not voting also sends a strong message

Pretty much just had this conversation. Except my point was if you want further left, then you have to give Dems consistent victories. Because when they lose they go to the center to find votes. Remember Dems have had all 3 (house, Senate, presidency) for only 4 years of the last 24 years.

[–] [email protected] 14 points 5 months ago

And during those four years they only had a super majority that could overcome the GOPs automatic use of the filibuster for a very short period of time when Independents caucused with the Dems, and even then there were some holdouts that watered down the best parts of what they were able to get through.

[–] [email protected] 36 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago) (1 children)

Well said sir

Left wing people walked away from the Democrats after 1968, and they had every righteous reason to. Did the Democrats suddenly start embracing actual leftism as a winning strategy as a result? Did a viable third party emerge? Did non electoral activism (much more powerful at the time, like a massive nationwide movement) finally take hold and upend the system to bring about real, sustained change?

Not exactly. We went, in that time, from "great society" and 1-income families who owned their home and sent kids to college, and the civil rights act and all that stuff, to Reagan -> Clinton -> Bush and the fuckin apocalypse that's brought us the current corporate hellscape. The reality of working life in today's America would be unrecognizable to most (white) people in the 1960s. The Democrats, after 24 years of losing elections (ironically enough, losing them by fielding leftist candidates like McGovern, McCarthy, and Carter), finally tacked hard to the right and started being contenders again, but we lost a lot of ground and we're only just now even starting to undo the damage. The party of JFK and Carter became the party of Clinton and Obama.

I actually think modern left wing people are aware of how terrifying Trump is, and would vote for Biden even if he wasn't a significant step up from the low bar that is the modern Democrats. But yes, the drumbeat of MAGA imposters and the occasional confused leftist saying that if we just stop voting then everything will find a way to work itself out is certainly a thing that exists.

[–] [email protected] 11 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago) (7 children)

(ironically enough, losing them by fielding leftist candidates like McGovern, McCarthy, and Carter),

And when Gore and Hillary Clinton stuck their head a little bit left on climate change, they lost. And people wonder why Dems go to the center to find voters.

[–] [email protected] 22 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago) (1 children)

I have no particular love for either of the Clintons but I'm still sad about Gore. Between the Iraq and Afghanistan wars, real action on climate change before it was too late, and the underregulation that led to the 2008 financial crash, the whole fuckin world would be different if he'd been allowed into office after he won the election.

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[–] [email protected] 8 points 5 months ago (1 children)

Remember Dems have only had all 3 (house, Senate, presidency) for 4 years of the last 24 years.

And when you take it to a filibuster-proof majority they have had even less control than that.

[–] [email protected] 13 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago) (1 children)

Filibuster proof majority for 4 months out of the last 44 years. Not 4 years, 4 months.

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[–] [email protected] 11 points 5 months ago (1 children)

And at every other time of the political cycle they will be on and on about how they're the only ones who really take the threat of fascism in this country seriously.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 5 months ago (1 children)

I mean, they claim that now, even as they say "It doesn't matter if a literal fascist gets in power; support for anti-fascist coalitions is unforgivable!"

[–] [email protected] 9 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago) (20 children)

In the run-up to the 1932 German elections, the left-wing party was still calling the establishment-left party the "main" enemy, and fighting them in the streets and siphoning support away from them by running their own candidates in three-way elections that also included Hitler. A few years later, most of them were dead, since they were the very first of his targets, long before the Jews.

[–] [email protected] -5 points 5 months ago

And the same pattern repeats today, with MLs calling everyone else 'social fascists' or like terms and crying "After ~~Hitler~~ Trump, us!", while playing the victim if they're ever called out on it.

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[–] [email protected] 21 points 5 months ago (1 children)

You better watch out PugJesus, I just got accused of being a bot in another thread for having this point of view 😂

[–] [email protected] 20 points 5 months ago (1 children)

I'm used to tankie whinging about how they can't support fascist regimes without being called out.

[–] [email protected] 10 points 5 months ago (2 children)

I hit em with the “maybe your views are just unpopular?” and have yet to see a response…

[–] [email protected] 7 points 5 months ago (1 children)

The response was probably " banned elliot_crane" from .ml + hexbear, and the ban conveniently didn't federate to .world's modlog

[–] [email protected] 4 points 5 months ago

lmao I wouldn’t be surprised if that happened a long time ago.. I’ve been calling out this shit for months.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 5 months ago

It doesn't matter. They don't believe in democracy, much less convincing people. They're vanguardist fascists, after all.

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