this post was submitted on 02 May 2024
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My parents raised me to always say "yes sir" and "no ma'am", and I automatically say it to service workers and just about anyone with whom I'm not close that I interact with. I noticed recently that I had misgendered a cashier when saying something like "no thank you, ma'am" based on their appearing AFAB, but on a future visit to the store they had added their pronouns (they) to their name tag. I would feel bad if their interaction with me was something they will remember when feeling down. This particular person has a fairly androgynous haircut/look and wears a store uniform, so there's no gender clue there.

I am thinking I need to just stop saying "sir" and "ma'am" altogether, but I like the politeness and I don't know how I would replace it in a gender-neutral way. Is there anything better than just dropping it entirely?

For background I'm a millennial and more than happy to use people's correct pronouns if I know them!

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[–] [email protected] 9 points 6 months ago

Just drop the pronouns. Super easy, doesn’t change based on who your are speaking to, and just saying Thanks or Thank You is 1000x better than your average retail customer.

[–] [email protected] 5 points 6 months ago (2 children)

I recently said “thanks mate” to a blatant MtF person that works for the same organisation as I do. I probably very visibly shit a brick and thought “not your best choice of words”. If it’s obvious, I will use gendered words, if someone has pronouns or something to make it obvious how they want to be referred to, I’ll use them. If it’s not obvious, and they have nothing to indicate how they want to be referred to, I’ll just be polite.

Mistakes happen, be polite and apologise and I reckon you’ll be fine.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 6 months ago (1 children)

I always look "mate" to be totally gender neutral.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 6 months ago

This makes me feel better. It’s just I seem to see it be said to men more. Apparently if she feels the need to call you out on how you are towards her, she does, and she didn’t, so…

[–] [email protected] 2 points 6 months ago* (last edited 6 months ago) (1 children)

Are you in the UK? I'm an Aussie and I've always considered "mate" to be gender neutral. I've seen all combinations of men and women saying it to each other.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 6 months ago

Yes, I wouldn’t say women don’t say it here, but I think it’s majority male, and this woman is blatantly MtF.

[–] [email protected] 21 points 6 months ago (1 children)

I'll often just go for a "thank you kindly!". It has the same flow.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 6 months ago

That IS pretty good...

[–] [email protected] -2 points 6 months ago (1 children)

So you’ve gone an entire lifetime saying these things with no problem, and then one day you encounter someone who’s decided to request “they them” pronouns, and youre going to drop this entire habit?

Did this person signal to you that you’d hurt them somehow? It sounds like they corrected an error on your part. Unless they displayed some anger or hurt, perhaps it’s just that you used the same pronouns everyone else does by virtue of how they present themselves, and then they corrected you, and you can use their pronouns from here on out.

I don’t think you should model this as a situation where you hurt someone. You used wrong info, got corrected, and you can move on.

Don’t start misgendering 99% of the people you meet just because one person corrected your assumption once. Don’t do that. Your cultural upbringing is not garbage to be discarded so easily.

[–] [email protected] 17 points 6 months ago

Dude is trying to be more considerate in his life and your response is basically "don't" lmao wild

[–] [email protected] 27 points 6 months ago (2 children)

I think just go the Invader Zim route and infer honorifics by height.

"Yes, my tallest" and "forgive me, my tallest" should cover you in most yes/no situations.

And if they're not taller than you? Well then they're less intelligent, so you can turn up your nose in scorn and look over heads until they go away.

I learned a lot of about social interaction from that show.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 6 months ago (1 children)

If they are short do you use "Short <king/queen/sovereign>" instead?

[–] [email protected] 1 points 6 months ago* (last edited 6 months ago)

No, you call them "shorty" and make wild claims about it being their birthday

[–] [email protected] 6 points 6 months ago* (last edited 6 months ago) (3 children)

Funny, but problematic. I know it's a joke.

I like the idea to use unexpected cumpliment, as "my connoisseur", "my most esteemed", "my commander", "my captain", "my sibling", "my comrade", "boss", "friend", or something.

Pointing at physical characteristics? Not as amazing.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 6 months ago

Pointing at physical characteristics? Not as amazing.

Worse? Or better?

[–] [email protected] 4 points 6 months ago* (last edited 6 months ago) (1 children)

Come to brasil where people are called champion, master, professor, doctor, or warrior.

Saying thanks to the cashier? “Thanks, doctor”

Edit: But Portuguese is gendered so I guess this doesn’t avoid the original problem… except in English it would

[–] [email protected] 3 points 6 months ago

Commander, captain, uncle, brother, comrade, Chief, big friend Bring us down another round

[–] [email protected] 2 points 6 months ago

I quite like the idea of something in the spirit of "yes my good fellow", with fellow obviously being a bit too masculine despite its chuminess.

What about using some generic gender neutral names like Robin or Quinn (even if their name isn't Robin or Quinn):

"Yes my good Robin" or "Yes my good Quinn"

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