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Jewish Voice for Peace in Germany had their bank account frozen. Bank demands names and adresses of all members the organization alledged (www.juedische-stimme.de)
submitted 7 months ago* (last edited 7 months ago) by [email protected] to c/[email protected]
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EDIT: The header of the english statement has been updated in the statement on the website of the group. The term confiscation has distinct legal meanings that could be confused and the way the term is often used in common language is inaccurate for the legal meaning. See @[email protected] s comment showing the legal distinction.

~~In 2024, Jewish money is once again being confiscated by a German bank:~~ Berliner Sparkasse freezes Jewish Voice account

On 25 March 2024, our account with the Berliner Sparkasse was frozen with immediate effect. In a letter, the Sparkasse informed us that it had taken this step as a precautionary measure and that we should submit numerous internal documents by 5 April to update our customer data. As a public corporation, the bank is bound by public law and may therefore not arbitrarily freeze accounts without providing an explanation, which it did not. It is also highly unusual that the required documents include a list of our members with their full names and addresses.

Why should this information be important to the Berliner Sparkasse? It sounds more like a question that might be asked by an intelligence service or the police, who have been politically persecuting us as a Jewish organisation for some time. Our previous account with the Bank for Social Economy was closed in 2019 because of our support for BDS. This happened after agitation by Israeli journalist Benjamin Weinthal and pressure from the Central Council of Jews in Germany.

This pressure and political persecution are increasing as Israel and its apartheid policies in the state of Israel and the West Bank, and now its genocidal policies in the Gaza Strip, lose support around the world. Germany is one of Israel"s last loyal allies, and the German state is co-operating with Israel"s apartheid and genocide, even though over 80% of the population does not support the German government"s policy.

The Palestine Congress will take place in Berlin in mid-April and will feature a wide range of international speakers, including the former Greek Finance Minister Yanis Varoufakis. The closer the congress gets, the more intense the persecution becomes; for weeks, there has been shrill defamation from the tabloid media and local politicians, such as describing it as a "hate summit" for which "thousands of anti-Semites" will be coming to Berlin. Because the journalists can"t write anything factual about it, they try to delegitimise the congress through guilt by association.

However, because the organisers are independent of politics, the usual methods such as cancellation or denial of spaces do not work. The congress is financed by ticket sales and donations; we, the Jewish Voice, have made our account available for this purpose – which is why it has now been blocked. We will not be intimidated by this, even if we lose our account: Our position on genocide is derived from our Jewish values and is not dependent on financial resources. Our membership grows with every day and every act of repression. Anyone who is a member of our organisation knows it themselves. It is none of any bank"s business. We are taking legal action against the arbitrary, politically motivated freezing of our account, which is unacceptable in a democracy.

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[–] [email protected] 0 points 7 months ago* (last edited 7 months ago)

German institutions in particular should stay out of the business of fucking with Jewish groups. I mean, malaka, come on.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 7 months ago (2 children)

Germany defining what it means to be Jewish again.

They have a special responsibility due to their history, but they deal with this crisis with all the gracefulness of a bull in a china shop.

According to the researcher Emily Dische-Becker, almost a third of those cancelled in Germany for their supposed antisemitism have been Jews.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 7 months ago

German politics are about activism and populism, nobody gives a fuck about useful results

[–] [email protected] 0 points 7 months ago (1 children)

Well I mean have you seen their language? It's the verbal equivalent of brute force.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 7 months ago

Ich bin ein Teil von jener Kraft, Die stets das Böse will und stets das Gute schafft. ... Ich bin der Geist, der stets verneint! Und das mit Recht; denn alles, was entsteht, ist wert, daß es zugrunde geht;
drum besser wär's, daß nichts entstünde. So ist denn alles, was ihr Sünde, Zerstörung, kurz das Böse nennt, mein eigentliches Element.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 7 months ago (2 children)

Tbf I am also curious what the specific legal reason is but really:

Jewish money is once again being confiscated

That is not true. No money has been confiscated. The account was temporarily frozen.
According to a statement by the bank they seem to be conducting a legitimacy check.
That is something banks can be obligated to do e.g. when there are indications for money laundering.

I'm not saying the bank is necessarily right here but the linked article here by the investigated organization itself is hardly unbiased.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 7 months ago

Nobody said it was confiscated, you’re just making that up. The money is being seized according to the headline. While inside the article the word frozen is being used.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 7 months ago (1 children)

At the time there was no news article available.

A bank account being frozen can be referred to as confiscation though. It means that you loose the factual control over your property. When a teacher confiscates the phones of students to give them back at the end of the school day. Or when police confiscates all your electronics in a criminal investigation, only to give them back month later.

It is true that there currently is not the level of permanence that the term can also include. However it means that the organization is unable to operate and there is strong reason to believe their stance that this is done for politican reasons just shortly before they want to hold a conference.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 7 months ago (1 children)

A bank account being frozen can be referred to as confiscation though.

I'm pretty sure that is neither true in English nor in German.
Those are two legally distinct measures.
For example many Russian accounts have been frozen in light of the Ukraine war but the money has explicitly not been confiscated.
See https://www.europarl.europa.eu/thinktank/en/document/EPRS_STU(2024)759602

I'm not denying the impact on their operations and I have neither pro nor contra arguments as to whether this is politically motivated.
But I think that confiscated is factually wrong. And at least to me personally it seems deliberately chosen to invoke an image of Germany seizing Jewish property "once again" like the Nazis.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 7 months ago* (last edited 7 months ago) (1 children)

The factual control over that property is taken away from the owner. That is confiscation. For any physical property that term is used directly in that sense. The term "freezing" for bank accounts has established in that sector but it remains valid to speak of confiscation as the factual control over that asset is seized from the owner. For that is is irrespective of whether the recognized ownership has changed. I.e. if a police officer takes all the money out of your wallet and puts it in a safe at the police station it still has been confiscated from you, even if he gives you a letter stating it is still your money. You are denied access to it, until some decision has been reached by someone.

The only legal distinction here is that the bank is a regulated private or in this case public entity that is legally seperate from the executive, whereas the police is a direct executive organ.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 7 months ago (1 children)

Listen, there is a legal distinction between the two terms. I've provided a source.
If you disagree with that, please take it up with legislators and the courts.

It doesn't help your argument that you specifically point out that it applies to physical objects, which a bank account is not.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 7 months ago* (last edited 7 months ago)

When i checked again the statement by the group has been updated, now using the term freezing in the bold part of the statement:

Berliner Sparkasse freezes Jewish Voice account

You are right that there could be a legal confusion around the term confiscation and the statement was updated probably to reflect the point you made about the legal meaning.

In the common usage both in English and German the term is broader what i argued for.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Confiscation

Confiscation (from the Latin confiscatio "to consign to the fiscus, i.e. transfer to the treasury") is a legal form of seizure by a government or other public authority. The word is also used, popularly, of spoliation under legal forms, or of any seizure of property as punishment or in enforcement of the law.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 7 months ago

For context, the Berliner Sparkasse is a subsidiary bank of the Landesbank Berlin. It used to be owned by the state of Berlin but has been sold to the group of Sparkassen in 2007 to deal with the states debt. It is therefore owned by a few hundred state and muncipality banks.

The bank is in full public ownership. The government of the state of Berlin can remove members of the executive board at any time if it sees the banks actions in violation of any law. There is also an advisory board that is appointed by the state government and members can be removed from the advisory board at any time, without any specified reasons in the law.

The bank is publicly owned and subject to possible direct intereference by the state government of Berlin, which has been particularly strongly cracking down on peace activists including arrests of jewish activists for peace and bans of demonstrations by jewish peace organizations such as the Jewish Voice for Peace in the first month after Hamas attacked Israel on 07. October.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 7 months ago

Collaboration in genocide, is that like an investment? Unless this group did illegal stuff, the bank (Sparkasse again - which also finances invasion in Ukraine) is a criminal organization.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 7 months ago

Germany historically always had problems with jewish voices.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 7 months ago* (last edited 7 months ago) (1 children)

So Germany is bullying and obstructing the free speech of Jews in order to protect Israel from dissenting opinion? Because that's what it sounds like. It's also kind of dumb that they are accusing Jewish Voice for Peace (an organization of primarily US Jews) of being antisemitic. No true Scotsman and all that eh?

[–] [email protected] 0 points 7 months ago* (last edited 7 months ago)

I highly doubt that the government is involved in this. Most likely other Jews (the Central Council) are bullying the bank to do this