this post was submitted on 07 Mar 2025
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Mechanical Keyboards

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I bought this clacky thing and started using emacs for the third(?) time. (midwest.social)
submitted 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago) by [email protected] to c/[email protected]
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And now I'm (slowly) typing this in dvorak.

spoilerThe vi keys are better than qwerty's home row. It's been two days and I'll die on this hill.

Is it terminal?

Edit: Guess I should mention it's a Nuphy Air60 V2 given the com. I was a bit hasty.

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[–] [email protected] 2 points 1 month ago (1 children)

For around 20 years now, I've been using emacs (maybe one or two years), vim (maybe 10+ years?), neovim (maybe about 2 years), then kakoune for about a year, and now helix for about 2 years.

Also been using the i3 window manager for probably 15 years.

So I'm definitely one to be used to the "vi keys".

But I never understood why people would navigate the lines and columns in their files using hjkl. It's so damn slow. Using w, e or b is much faster and more accurate. And using / to search to jump farther is also much faster, even if you are using jk with a count modifier.

Not to mention the more modern ways of navigating files now by using the power of a language server. You can have stuff like find-and-jump-to-symbol, or jumping between all the different occurrences of a symbol. It's blisteringly fast compared to hjkl. I rarely use hjkl, at least not hl.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 1 month ago (1 children)

You're hitting the nail on the head there. I've always used b/e and honestly forgot w for motion until recently. Trying out dvorak is kind of breaking the habit in-editor aside from menu nav. Doom with evil-mode also has 's' as a quick 2-letter isearch that is incredibly handy. I've seen about helix and other modern projects, they just seem to stray from the weirdness I learned to love about vim, even if they may be more intuitive.

Using hyprland, emacs, and now dvorak too is tangling my brain sometimes. I've resolved to using super for my WM mod key as to not mess up emacs even though it's less comfortable. I'm considering making a post to get a feel for peoples' use of alt layouts, WM bindings, and Extend/layers. Just not sure if this would be the right com or not.

To pack some more in here unsolicited, I also worked out a capslock overload that is kinda wild. Tap for oneshot control, hold for super, or tap-then-hold to hold control. The super-hold even reverts to a control when intending to use the oneshot and rolling too fast. Oh, and hitting caps again in the oneshot gives escape since caps to control/escape was my original overload. It's gnarly and I want to post about it too at some point.

Apologies for the dump lol, might have to come back to this if I decide to post.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 1 month ago (1 children)

Apologies for the dump lol, might have to come back to this if I decide to post.

Don't worry, I love it.

Say, have you heard about the Colemak-DH layout? I've never tried a different layout other than QWERTY in my life, but I'm excited to try and learn CDH after I get my ZSA Voyager split keyboard. I'm freaking giddy about that keyboard. I'm 38, I feel like waiting for Christmas Eve again. I also have a beefy computer ordered which I'm waiting on. Nope, not as exciting as the Voyager. 🤓

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 month ago (1 children)

Yep, this site and DreymaR's have been a big part of my layout exploration and wrapping my head around layers.

I'm actually considering switching to something newer instead like Colemak-DH (really interested in wide mod not having a split board) or canary, graphite, gallium, etc, etc. So many to look at. I kinda glossed over Colemak in general wanting to really step away from QWERTY and start with good habits. Dvorak is an eye opening wonder for me, I'm just not sure it's what I want to stick with. It's honestly amazing it's still ergonomically competitive with all the computer-aided layouts today. If I can figure out enough of the theory and my own preferences, I might look at making my own. Not so sure about that yet.

I don't know what I'd be more excited for. A new machine can be incredible depending on the jump in specs. But I think the RTX card in my laptop that I could finally game on was even overshadowed by using a high refresh display for the first time. Peripherals really make a difference.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 1 month ago (1 children)

I'm actually considering switching to something newer instead like Colemak-DH

Cool, man, let's do it together! I already switched my key caps around on my mechanical keyboard, and replaced QWERTY with regular Colemak on GBoard on my phone. (Sadly the -DH variant wasn't available there). All in, baby, let's go!

Peripherals really make a difference.

Definitely. I remember the first time I got a high frame rate display, was in complete awe. All that motion!

depending on the jump in specs.

Indeed, this should be a fairly good jump, I think. I built my current machine in 2020. Now:

  • 3900X -> 9900X3D
  • RTX 2080 Super -> RT 9070 XT (it's no 7900 XT but it's a big upgrade for the buck)

Along with all the other modern upgrades you can think of. So I should be ecstatic lol. But my mind just keeps drifting off to the Voyager 💀

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 month ago

I don't know if I'll ever move from qwerty on mobile. Swipe to text seems like a different beast, but I'm curious how it is. I was thinking it might be the one thing qwerty is good for!

I made a couple quick hops Canary -> Gallium v2 -> Graphite.

All I really know I like is alternation (thank you dvorak) and outward rolls oddly enough. Also typing ls ~/ was awful in dvorak, so less right pinky. SFBs can be deceptively packed too, even trigrams. Other than that, the j/k positions didn't sit right with me in layouts like Colemak, which is what Gallium showed me. I've probably jammed my right index more than my other fingers now that I think about it...

I definitely didn't like the stretch for j on modded Gallium. After that, Graphite actually surprised me with the pinky for j. Using the wide mod, it's 100% an illusion, but the key seems easier to hit with fewer keys to the right of my hand. It's exactly the same angle and distance lmao.

Layouts really make no sense until the smallest things click and you realize that's what those stats mean. Why is it kind of like baseball?

RTX 2080 Super -> RT 9070 XT

I bought my 2070 laptop in 2020 too. I have yet to build a nice machine, but AMD might be the move if that ever happens. Their model numbering never made any sense to me though lol

Also, I want a Voyager now... I think split, columnar, and thumb keys are my next steps. Almost wanted to go ortho for a second. I quickly stumbled upon a bluetooth corne, too. It's all so $400-too-much right after my first mech. It was a relatively cheap one but still!

[–] [email protected] 7 points 2 months ago (1 children)

Dvorak is only clumsy for the first few years. After that, you stop thinking about it and it feels natural.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 2 months ago (1 children)

Lol idk if there's a maybe little sarcasm there, but honestly, I love it already. I've been averaging about 15 wpm at 80% accuracy, and getting the groove to manage a few seconds at 30 wpm is so smooth.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 2 months ago (2 children)

Good work! Only a little sarcasm, but after 35 years, I can type faster than I can write, and it just feels like thinking into the computer. (Does it feel the same for QWERTY typists? I dunno)

[–] [email protected] 1 points 2 months ago

I probably only get around 70wmp in bursts with qwerty, but I also type faster than I write. The best way I can describe the difference is my fingers feel all spider-like with qwerty, but in dvorak, I feel like I'm jookin (I was trying to think of a faster shuffle-y footwork, but this is sick). I can feel a different level of flow even at slower speeds.

[–] [email protected] 5 points 2 months ago (1 children)

QWERTY typist here, yes

[–] [email protected] 2 points 1 month ago

Close to 120 WPM QWERTY here, yes.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 2 months ago (1 children)

Please don't dedicate yourself to only Dvorak, or you'll forget how to use qwerty and alienate yourself to only your keyboards. Try alternating between both, I did the same for Colemak and now I can type both with similar speeds

[–] [email protected] 1 points 2 months ago

Lol yeah, I did then same thing but went a little overboard. I type Colemak on my split ortho tented keyboard exclusively. I also learned to properly touch type on colemak. I've trained my muscle memory to the point I cannot type colemak on anything other than my split and If I try and touch type properly on a qwerty keyboard I end up defaulting back to colemak. To me they're almost entirely different skillsets!

[–] [email protected] 2 points 2 months ago (1 children)

So you use default vim bindings with dvorak? I use neovim and type in qgmlwy but I remapped the bindings in my config.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 2 months ago

I haven't tried it with vim in full yet, but I was surprised by how comfortable the hjkl positions are in dvorak. i like tiling window managers with win+vi keys for navigation and such, so it would be important. Dvorak L is kind of annoying at P, and I'm trying to make myself hit it with the pinky usually, but it actually feels alright for keying around in navigation.

I mostly don't want to have to end up rebinding everything, possibly for every program I use indefinitely, if I stick with the layout. So I'm just learning the new positions to start, and will probably always need a way to switch to qwerty for games.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 2 months ago (2 children)

What’s Emacs? Is it as good as Vim?

[–] [email protected] 5 points 2 months ago

Emacs is a lovely operating system used by many. I think it also has a text editor.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 2 months ago

Really wondering to myself if I should take this seriously or not, but I use doom with evil-mode fwiw. Both are holy saints.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 2 months ago (1 children)

Can you expand on your setup?

[–] [email protected] 3 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago) (1 children)

As far as the keyboard, I got a Nuphy Air60 V2 as my first. Maybe not super top, but it's comfy and I'm loving it. Emacs is a rabbithole, unless you wanna get into that too lol

Oh, and the switches are Nuphy's special moss LPs. I think they're supposed to be like slightly heavier browns?

[–] [email protected] 3 points 2 months ago (2 children)

Did you reprogram reach key until you had dvorak layout, or is there a preset or something? I'm also not sure what youre doing with emacs or really what it even is 😬

[–] [email protected] 1 points 2 months ago

Also thought I'd mention keyd (if you use linux). It's a system-wide remapper. I considered whether to use software or the firmware, just because keyd has such a neat spec with layers, oneshots, and key overloads. It's great.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago)

I used Via because there's a qmk version of the firmware, and yeah, I just set one of the layers to the layout. The Nuphy has a switch for Win/Mac mode that toggles between layer 1 (with 2 and 3 for modifiers) and 4 (with 5 and 6 for modifiers), so I can switch easily between qwerty. I actually did that to finish this cause I'm still slow as hell lol.

Emacs is "just" a text editor that's an operating system in disguise, waaaay too configurable and macro'd out than any software should be. Or like all software should be, maybe.