this post was submitted on 19 Jan 2024
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Linux is a family of open source Unix-like operating systems based on the Linux kernel, an operating system kernel first released on September 17, 1991 by Linus Torvalds. Linux is typically packaged in a Linux distribution (or distro for short).

Distributions include the Linux kernel and supporting system software and libraries, many of which are provided by the GNU Project. Many Linux distributions use the word "Linux" in their name, but the Free Software Foundation uses the name GNU/Linux to emphasize the importance of GNU software, causing some controversy.

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TL;DR: It's basically a WSL for Linux. Linux subsystem for Linux if you will.
It let's you install and use pretty much any software ever written for Linux, including AUR packages and graphical apps, on any distro you want. You should all give it a try!


Distrobox is probably the best thing ever.
If bread existed in the Linux world, Distrobox would be the equivalent, or better than sliced bread.
It just solves many of the problems that plagued us in the past!


I'm just sick of answering so many comments or posts where people either

  • almost dislocate their joints in trying to get some software working on their distro, where it isn't officially supported;
  • or choose/ leave a particular distro based on the amount of available packages, e.g. Arch.

**The answer is simple: use fucking containers. **

Before I turned into a weird "immutable distro"-user, I slapped every random install onto my host OS.
After all this shit building up over years, and cluttering my system, it turned against me. Repos not being available, packages conflicting, weird icons popping up, and more. It was a mess!

If one did that on a server, he would probably get slapped by the Selfhosted-community.
If there's Docker, Podman and more, especially for servers, why don't we use it for desktop too?

Some guy probably thought the same and made Distrobox.
You can just download BoxBuddy as Flatpak and/ or install it via package manager.
BoxBuddy is a graphical frontend, that helps you manage and use your containers. It's pretty new tho and is still in heavy development.
Traditionally, Distrobox is CLI-only, but I can see that changing in the near future.


"Why not just use a VM?"

Those containers aren't isolated and barely draw additional resources. Actually, they're somewhat comparable to Flatpaks.
They provide themselves with their stuff they need, but aren't virtualized. The main difference between Flatpaks and DB-containers for myself is that Flatpaks have permissions.

They can and will interact with your host. For example, if I plug in my phone, I can access it via ADB in my Arch container. Or my Nextcloud-client can open my browser and auto start on boot.


Who needs that?

Everyone. Well, maybe. Depends.

Image distros

Certainly users of image based ("immutable") distros like Fedora Silverblue and other variants of this family, like uBlue (Bazzite, etc.).
While we actually could install every package from the Fedora repo traditionally on our host, this should be avoided.
Steam Deck users would benefit strongly too, since they can only use Flatpaks atm.

People who can't get some packages with their distro

One of the main arguments, why so many users go or stay on Arch, is the AUR.

Often, they have a love-hate-relationship with it. It might break easily if you do something wrong, which is easily done for many users. At the same time, it gives them their niche software they need.

What if I told you, that you can enjoy this huge plus point for Arch on every other distro too, while benefiting from the comfort of your favourite distro?

You can even install an Ubuntu container and use Snaps there if you enjoy using them.

Developers

On the stock Fedora Silverblue, there's Toolbx pre-installed, which does something very similar, but not as good. It's a RedHead product.
On uBlue on the other hand, Distrobox is the default, which is better.

Toolbx' main use case is programming. For devs working with different Python-versions for example and don't wanna risk breaking their OS.

DB does the same, but more.


But why is it so powerful?

You can also export your software to your host.
E.g., the Flatpak version of Nextcloud didn't work well for me. The Arch package on the other hand is less buggy and looks properly. It's perfectly integrated in my system and I don't notice it at all that it hasn't been installed natively.

This even extends to DEs and TWMs! You could, for example, create an Arch container only for Hyprland, which you basically can't install on other distros.
And then, you can use said example, or the beta-version of the new Plasma, on OpenSuse Leap.

On uBlue at least, all my containers update themselves too.

Another great thing is the modularity.
You can, for example, just delete the Arch container if it breaks randomly or due to user error, without worrying about losing access to your PC or having to troubleshoot for hours.


All in all, just try it. Trust me.

all 32 comments
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[–] [email protected] 0 points 8 months ago (1 children)

Just curious. I tried distrobox and it wasn't that easy. Isn't flatpak+appimage+nix better alternative?

[–] [email protected] 1 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago)

There is no good and bad. Every format or solution has other pros, cons, and especially use cases.

Flatpak is simple and for GUI only.
Appimage is portable.
Nix is reproducible and developer friendly, but pretty complicated too.

And Distrobox' main advantage is that you can use any container-distro.
If you want some software that only runs on Ubuntu, Nix won't get you far.
It might not be perfect (see other comments for examples), but for some use cases, it's the best solution.

As long as it gets you to your goal, anything is good.
Hell, even Snaps can be a good choice if you need some specific software and this format provides you easy access to that. Personal choice and such...

[–] [email protected] 1 points 8 months ago (1 children)

people get grumpy about containers vs nix vs flatpak and I just wanna say... I'm glad you're using Linux. yes, you.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 7 months ago

@pl_woah @Guenther_Amanita I regard these all these things as nerd toys for exploring innovation ...

[–] [email protected] -1 points 8 months ago (1 children)

**The answer is simple: use fucking containers. **

Ha ha ha ha ha. Oh summer child.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 8 months ago

If you're gonna dismiss it like that then I'd love to hear what your pain points are. What's so bad about containers for multi-platform applications?

[–] [email protected] 1 points 8 months ago (1 children)

How long have you been using distrobox and which were the biggest painpoints yet?

[–] [email protected] 1 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago)

I'm leaning, tendentionally, more towards the tech enthusiastic normie side.

I don't have experience in programming or professional working in IT in general. I just like Linux.

I used it for following stuff the last few months:

  • Minor administrative tasks of my home server (ssh, etc.)
  • Executing scripts
  • Flashing CustomROMs onto my phones a few times
  • Accessing/ modding the phone, e.g. debloating or ADB
  • Exporting an application to desktop if the flatpak doesn't work, e.g. Nextcloud client (Flatpak was unlegible due to Qt/GTK)
  • Trying some nieche apps, especially from the AUR or in collaboration with a dev on GitHub
  • and some more things

The only problems I encountered were probably due to my immutable host distro, for example because of missing folders. Many programs want to access/ change some binaries, which don't exist, because they are behind /var/bin/.../ and not /bin/.../ for example.

When I used the normal Fedora on one device, and the Atomic on another, one program did work on the mutable (in a Debian container), while the one on Atomic (same container) gave me errors.

[–] [email protected] -1 points 8 months ago (2 children)

Distrobox: If AppImage isn't already enough overhead for you, just install an entire Linux distribution for each application.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago)

The "entire Linux distribution" is very small. It's only like a few hundred MBs.
I have absolutely crappy internet, pretty much the worst in Europe to be precise, and it only took 30 seconds or so with 5 mb/s speed to download.

And you don't install a new distro for every app, you do that for every task.

E.g., I have an Arch container for every CLI-related (installing custom ROMs on my phone, server administration, etc.) and one Ubuntu/ Fedora one for everything else if I need it.
The latter one is basically unused btw.

[–] [email protected] -2 points 8 months ago (1 children)

Yeah, I'm not sure what the hard-on is for containerization.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 8 months ago (1 children)

I’m not sure what the hard-on is for containerization.

Bazzite uses Steam in an Arch-based Distrobox container. The FAQ doesn't address what the benefits of that over just using Flatpak are.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 7 months ago (1 children)

We stopped doing this a few versions ago, main reason was inconsistency between the deck and desktop branches, since deck needs to be properly layered due to it essentially being a desktop environment.

Additionally, we're not able to offer HDR or steam input with Wayland through distrobox. That being said, bazzite-arch remains a distrobox image with real utility for other use cases and we continue to maintain it.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 7 months ago (1 children)

We stopped doing this a few versions ago

And how are you deploying Steam now? Any chance for easily discoverable documentation about such things?

[–] [email protected] 2 points 7 months ago* (last edited 7 months ago) (1 children)

It's layered into the image like any other rpm. Standard steam package you'd install in Workstation.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 7 months ago* (last edited 7 months ago)

It’s layered into the image like any other rpm. Standard steam package you’d install in Workstation.

Good, considering Steam updates itself anyway.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago) (1 children)

Any recommendations for a rolling-release immutable distro? Or does that not matter?

I haven't distrohopped in a while and I just might after hearing about Fedora Sericea (Immutable Fedora with swaywm). I just need to understand this whole immutable thing more, because I kind of get the idea but I don't understand basic things like how to install packages, for example.

Also, any way to install packages in an environment and not have it create config files in your home directory, but instead in a temporary directory? Like when you wanna test software but have to clean stuff up later, it's annoying

[–] [email protected] 1 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago)

I can make a post similar to this one here about image based distros if you want.


I think Fedora Atomic (Silverblue, Kinoite, Sericea, etc.) are the best choice atm.
It's the oldest and most sophisticated one and gives you the most choice.
Take a look into universal-blue.org if you like ease of use, want more DEs/ WMs than the few official ones, or have special hardware (Nvidia, etc.).

NixOS isn't immutable/ image based per definition, but even if it would, I personally would only recommend it to highly skilled people who have the time to work themselves into it. It has its benefits, but sounds like a lot of work and is very complicated due to lack of documentation.

OpenSuse Aeon is pretty new and doesn't have a big dev team behind it, and therefore I wouldn't trust it enough yet.

VanillaOS sounds also very promising, but is very immature atm and also has a small dev team.
It will be Debian-based very soon and wants to be a future-oriented Linux Mint alternative. Same philosophy (ease of use, stability, etc.), but different approach.
Sadly you are stuck to Gnome and can't rebase to something else, which is a no-go for a DE-hopper like myself.
But I am very interested in its future and will try it some time.


About installing software:

  • Choice #1 is Flatpak. It's simple, usually just works and is for everything graphical. It covers 99,9% of everything you want and need.
  • Choice #2: Distrobox and Nix, especially for CLI stuff. It's a bit more complicated than just hitting the install-button in the software center, but if you need that stuff, you are already used to work in the console anyway.
  • Choice #3: Direct install. I use Fedora Atomic as example here. You can still use your package manager (similar to dnf) and layer the packages. In practical use, it is the same as installing it traditionally, like with apt or dnf, but under the hood, you can imagine it like Gnome shell extensions. They can add, change or mask features the UI, but it's still Gnome and one toggle away. OSTree-layered packages are still separated from the base, but work exactly as if they would be installed on bare metal.

So you never loose any functionality, only some things are a tiny bit more complicated and different. Once you got it, you don't see it as impractical, but genius.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 8 months ago (2 children)

Why has nobody ever heard of Distrobox?

Because there's Flatpak.

[–] [email protected] -1 points 8 months ago

Flatpak is only for graphical programs

[–] [email protected] -1 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago)

And the only distros that actually matter are Debian and Red Hat Enterprise, so wtv.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago) (3 children)

You should check out Nix the package manager, which is an even better option than Distrobox if you want to install stuff independently of your distro's packaging system. The biggest advantage of using Nix is that there's no container layer, so you're running the binaries directly on your host OS - this means that the binary can have full access to system resources, which is handy if you need to run one of those apps with root privileges (try running a Distrobox exported app with sudo - it won't work). Or say you want to install something like a terminal emulator - it's not exactly practical to install it inside Distrobox, because now every time you run the terminal, you'd be viewing at your system from inside the container, which can makes things pretty messy.

Another advantage of Nix is that because you're dealing with actual binaries and not just a shim script, it can handle command line arguments properly and also handle things like stdin/stdout properly. In fact there's a bug right now with the way Distrobox export handles command line parameters, where it eats some of the parameters so your exported program may not work correctly. I had this issue with a Distrobox export of freerdp and raised an issue for it, but it still hasn't been fixed. So until this is fixed, I'd advise staying away from running distrobox exported stuff, unless you're using it for only simple apps/workflows.

Also, you don't have the hassle of having to maintain/update the Arch or whatever OS is installed inside your containers.

Finally, with Nix you can easily roll back your transactions or switch between multiple versions of the apps - all of which takes place instantly, because all it's doing is switching the symlinks in the Nix store.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 8 months ago

With Nix you have to do everything the Nix way. If a package doesn't work correctly or is missing you either have to dive deep into the Nix rabbit hole or wait till someone who knows stuff fixes your problem. With nix everything is all or nothing (even more so with NixOS).

Distrobox is the opposite, it embraces variety and gives you as many options/distro environments as it can. Once the missing container bugs are fixed you are dependent on no one to get your packages working.

Also, Nix is usually not the normal way devs package their software, so there always have to be people repackaging the stuff with nix (and updating when the source package changes).

Distrobox gives you access to the environment where the stuff is packaged already, a lot less work is needed to get working packages which should not be underestimated.

The more packages you install with nix the higher the probability you encounter packages no nix expert has cared for recently

[–] [email protected] 0 points 8 months ago (1 children)

The whole point of Distrobox is the you want access to the package manager ( well, the packages ) of a different distribution.

[–] [email protected] -1 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago)

Yes, but if that's all you're after then it's overkill, because Nix (probably) has all the packages you'd want. Unless that distro you're after has a special/unique package that's not found anywhere else or something.

According to Repology, Nix has around 90,000 packages, compared to AUR's 75k. Of course those numbers aren't exactly comparable given the loose definition of a "package", but it should be a rough indicator that surely you can get almost anything you want from Nix, without running into the limitations and complexities of Distrobox.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 8 months ago (1 children)

lots of softwares are missing in nix. distrobox with AUR is the best and safest option

[–] [email protected] 0 points 8 months ago (1 children)

Any examples of what's missing exactly?

[–] [email protected] 0 points 8 months ago (1 children)

I have seen many people on Lemmy mentioning Distrobox, who are you referring to?..

Also, yeah, it sounds neat. Thanks for the good post

[–] [email protected] 1 points 8 months ago

I'm not refering to any comment in particular, it's just that it happens all the time that someone doesn't know about that possibility.
I'm reading all the time stuff like "If you need this package, then the only option for you is Arch" or "I'm on Arch and can't install this Fedora package, I have to compile it myself", and so on.

Yeah, there are people mentioning it, but still, many many others have never heard about it, and I find that a bit sad.