A community to talk about the Fediverse and all it's related services using ActivityPub (Mastodon, Lemmy, KBin, etc).
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Learn more at these websites: Join The Fediverse Wiki, Fediverse.info, Wikipedia Page, The Federation Info (Stats), FediDB (Stats), Sub Rehab (Reddit Migration), Search Lemmy
This reddit post likely has tens if not hundreds of thousands of views, look at the top comment.
Lemmy is losing so many potential new users because the UX sucks for the vast majority of people.
What can we do?
Is this a poll result or an opinion? Because I like the Lemmy UX a lot better than reddit. I appreciate the single-page-app approach. But I use a PC, seems like most people do everything on phones now.
Who volunteers to fix it?
Good UI (in my android app) is the reason I came to Lemmy.
UI =/= UX, and UX is what the comment on the post was about
donald glover saying good dot gif
Maybe it’s personal bias but I’d put a lot more weight into the comments about
While I understand the power, the ideal of multiple federated servers, I still see it as an impediment for use. I know there’s online descriptions but I fail to see why I need to research and choose a server, especially when none really have the membership to support smaller communities yet
You don't need to research and choose a server, unless you have personal issues. I get the impression that some people are so polarized they feel like logging into the wrong server would put them on the Wrong Side and make them evil. Some also can't let go of the corporate media mindset that says domination is necessary for survival, or even that a contest is necessary. I just enjoy the content and ignore the complaints about numbers. The concept of multiple servers might keep some people away if they think they need to understand it, but they really don't.
The average person is going to have no idea what "federated" means. They'll probably assume it has something to do with the federal gov.
For the majority of commenters: UX is not UI.
The poor UX experience is the research a person has to do before they can even participate. You need to have a basic understanding of how the network works, and then you have to shop around for a server.
It’s enough friction to prevent people from on-boarding and that’s not good for a platform that needs people to be valuable.
Yes. Lemmy is not friendly for the "average" user. We could come up with a list of severs with pros and cons to them and then people would feel more comfortable. I came here the moment reddit killed the API and I was so confused. Federated anything meant nothing to me and I discovered lemmy.world so that's just what I joined. LOL I still don't know the difference between servers.
I disagree. I just found a link to lemmy.world, with no idea of how lemmy worked, and I'm perfectly happy. To me it seems like people's endless complaints about servers come down to personal issues.
Maybe this is a terrible thing to say, but I actually like that registering for federated sites requires a bit work.
IMO, the internet was more enjoyable when it was just full of us nerds 😅
Hmmm. Actually maybe it can be leveraged.
There should perhaps be a default instance that it funnels everyone into but makes a "power user" option available from a drop down where they can CHOOSE an instance. Make it an opt-in thing instead of a mandatory hurdle.
If they don't like the way the default instance is managed (content moderation, defederation) they can think "oh wait, there's a solution for this! Well, now that I know what I'm getting into it's not intimidating anymore"
Mastodon needs this too.
...
Mastodon needs this ESPECIALLY.
Yeah, that was my first thought when I read this too. There were plenty of people for whom the internet in general, or later social media, was too complex for them to bother with. I think each generation of technology leaves behind a certain % of people who are past the point of being willing or able to learn how to use something new, and that isn't really a bad thing.
Yes, you have to have some notion of what "federated" means and how it works to make full use of federated sites. But it's just asking people to learn a little bit about a couple new terms, and spending a few minutes outside of their comfort zone while they orient to a new environment, just like when the internet itself or social media started. And I think we obviate the entire point of building something new by trying to make it completely familiar and friction-less for people. If that was the best way to build community, then the internet would just be the phone book and social media would just be the personals section of a newspaper.
That does come with the unavoidable side effect that the majority of the people will simply not participate. It then follows that sites like Reddit will continue to be the place where the majority of the people will go.
If your goal is to participate in small communities and you are okay with the slow pace of those communities, then that's fine. If your goal is to move people away from corporate-sponsored media for whatever reason, then this won't work.
Bad UX made it hard for me to even make an account here lol, and I’m someone that has been promoting Lemmy for weeks. I think making the sign up process as easy as possible is how to do it. I’m still annoyed at how dumb it was trying to get on this site even.
When it comes to software things, I do tend to err on the side of supporting new users - I'll be the first to argue that a person should not have to learn how to use the terminal in order to use Linux.
That said, this situation is honestly bewildering to me. I cannot fathom how the idea of having choices could be considered, let alone by so many people to even make this into a controversy, to be bad design. That's the very thing that makes federation great.
You're all seriously overthinking this. Just look at a few of the most populated sites, and pick one that looks good. The choice makes 95% no difference in practice because on most instances you're going to see all the same content as soon as you press the All button anyway.
One thing I can imagine that would make the experience better, is maybe if there was a one-click way to join or migrate to another lemmy instance, using an existing login. Personally I don't think it's a big deal to just quickly sign up for a new instance if I want to. But I did see that Pixelfed has the option of signing on by using a Mastodon account. So maybe something like that can help?
"I cannot fathom how the idea of having choices could be considered, let alone by so many people to even make this into a controversy, to be bad design. That's the very thing that makes federation great."
Because for every choice presented, people want to know the consequences of each one before proceeding. It's a well understood problem in sales and marketing. People do not want to put themselves in a position where they have to undo. Companies like Apple do this very well. In computer shops, the reason staff are hired is to help get the customer from "wanting a laptop" to "choosing one laptop", rather than walk away feeling that they need to think about it more.
"Just look at a few of the most populated sites, and pick one that looks good. The choice makes 95% no difference in practice".
Maybe if they said that on the signup page it would help. I think it would have helped me. But just because you have a sense of what "looks good" doesn't mean the average person does. It's the average person that I want to interact with on the internet.
When I recommend federated sites to people, I literally just pick the ones I'm already on and send the link. Problem solved. They can learn more and try new things in their own time. It's also not hard to just tell them, "It's like email, but for the whole internet."
"Of Earth’s estimated 400,000 plant species, we could eat some 300,000, armed with the right imagination, boldness and preparation. Yet humans, possibly the supreme generalist, eat a mere 200 species globally, and half our plant-sourced protein and calories come from just three: maize, rice and wheat."
Would you consider biodiversity to also be bad ux? Maybe consider that the benefits of decentralization far outweigh the cons of your marketing programming, and that the issue is more one of education. Dumbing down and patronizing people like we need somebody to make our choices for us sounds like a solution that's worse than the problem.
Biodiversity is great. Abandoning confused users isn't. Those options can still exist without baffling the user.
"Marketing programming" understands the human condition and tries to facilitate people. That part - for all its other failings - is more empathetic than telling people who struggle that we refuse to "dumb down" the process for them.
Better UX than Reddit, they even point out that it’s like old.reddit instead of the trash UX they have now
It’s just dismissive to get people to agree without looking
You're confusing UX with UI. UX = user experience, the entire experience, UI = the interface. UX is the entire user experience, and for example for joining reddit, you go to reddit.com and join. For lemmy you learn there are dozens of large instances, with intricate politics between them and if you join the wrong one everyone thinks you're a tankie....
That's terrible and i can imagine people are put off by it.
The interface of lemmy itself is indeed ok, and is close to old reddit, which at least the people here prefer.
I am aware of the difference
I was only commenting on one part of it because I don’t believe the other parts warrant discussion
And it’s more than the interface, Reddit has algorithms to show you what it wants, old home is blank if you had no subs
Who cares? If someone can't figure out how to join a server, then I don't want them here. If people think that reddit has some amazing UX, then I don't want them here. If people think another corporate website (bluesky) will save us, then please stay away...
The post about Lemmy has 500 upvotes while the crybaby replies only have like 100. I'll happily take a ratio of 5 reasonable people joining Lemmy for every 1 weak baby staying on Reddit.
The question is: do we want people to leave corporate services, and join the fediverse, or not? By showing such hostility towards such "crybabies" we will never get any traction.
We are facing a problem. "Crybabies" are arguing about lack of content and/or difficulty on signing up. People on Lemmy are arguing that they don't want such users in their communities. Other people, thinking of onboarding, may not join after seeing hostile users like you.
I don't want anyone staying on Reddit tbh