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Have some civility. (lemmy.ml)

submitted 4 days ago by [email protected] to c/[email protected]

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[–] [email protected] 3 points 3 days ago (1 children)

Yes, would you be interested in starting a separate thread for further discussion? I'd also like to clear up my fuzziness. As a US-ian educated before education was quite as bad as it is now, I wouldn't have known about Herzl's attitudes that influenced his work, nor the Balfour agreement, had it not come up for an online discussion that came up with regard to Israel and Palestine in the late nineties or early aughts.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 3 days ago* (last edited 3 days ago) (2 children)

I feel like if we started a thread discussing this it would be like two AI's hallucinating against eachother. I'm also not very interested in Herzls backstory, for the simple reason that he saw the Palestinians the same way (or even worse) as the Europeans treated the Jews.

Herzl himself also was a very rich dude from a rich family and he certainly didn't face any of the suffering or antisemtism which other Jews faced at the time.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 3 days ago

I should be doing any number of things else, but this topic is bothering me. From what I've found on a quick search, pograms seemed stubbornly persistent, despite the revolutionary stance against, and discouragement of racist sentiment. I'll post links, and if there are refutations, look at them in due course.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pogroms_in_the_Russian_Empire

https://jacobin.com/2017/06/russian-revolution-antisemitism-pogroms-reactionary-workers

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pogroms_during_the_Russian_Civil_War

And from a Zionist perspective,

https://www.timesofisrael.com/20-years-before-the-holocaust-pogroms-killed-100000-jews-then-were-forgotten/

I've merely quickly skimmed these myself, but post here to return to read later, and for your perusal, at your leisure.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 3 days ago

I feel like if we started a thread discussing this it would be like two AI's hallucinating against eachother.

I certainly can understand that, while also wanting to get to the bottom of this! I'll probably start a new thread about it, but not right now.

Regarding his back story, I find it immensely interesting in that he was racist all around.

Herzl himself also was a very rich dude from a rich family and he certainly didn't face any of the suffering or antisemtism which other Jews faced at the time.

Oh wow! You writing that struck like lightning! Maybe his racism against Jews and Palestinians boils down to classism.