this post was submitted on 16 Oct 2024
102 points (91.8% liked)

politics

19104 readers
2595 users here now

Welcome to the discussion of US Politics!

Rules:

  1. Post only links to articles, Title must fairly describe link contents. If your title differs from the site’s, it should only be to add context or be more descriptive. Do not post entire articles in the body or in the comments.

Links must be to the original source, not an aggregator like Google Amp, MSN, or Yahoo.

Example:

  1. Articles must be relevant to politics. Links must be to quality and original content. Articles should be worth reading. Clickbait, stub articles, and rehosted or stolen content are not allowed. Check your source for Reliability and Bias here.
  2. Be civil, No violations of TOS. It’s OK to say the subject of an article is behaving like a (pejorative, pejorative). It’s NOT OK to say another USER is (pejorative). Strong language is fine, just not directed at other members. Engage in good-faith and with respect! This includes accusing another user of being a bot or paid actor. Trolling is uncivil and is grounds for removal and/or a community ban.
  3. No memes, trolling, or low-effort comments. Reposts, misinformation, off-topic, trolling, or offensive. Similarly, if you see posts along these lines, do not engage. Report them, block them, and live a happier life than they do. We see too many slapfights that boil down to "Mom! He's bugging me!" and "I'm not touching you!" Going forward, slapfights will result in removed comments and temp bans to cool off.
  4. Vote based on comment quality, not agreement. This community aims to foster discussion; please reward people for putting effort into articulating their viewpoint, even if you disagree with it.
  5. No hate speech, slurs, celebrating death, advocating violence, or abusive language. This will result in a ban. Usernames containing racist, or inappropriate slurs will be banned without warning

We ask that the users report any comment or post that violate the rules, to use critical thinking when reading, posting or commenting. Users that post off-topic spam, advocate violence, have multiple comments or posts removed, weaponize reports or violate the code of conduct will be banned.

All posts and comments will be reviewed on a case-by-case basis. This means that some content that violates the rules may be allowed, while other content that does not violate the rules may be removed. The moderators retain the right to remove any content and ban users.

That's all the rules!

Civic Links

Register To Vote

Citizenship Resource Center

Congressional Awards Program

Federal Government Agencies

Library of Congress Legislative Resources

The White House

U.S. House of Representatives

U.S. Senate

Partnered Communities:

News

World News

Business News

Political Discussion

Ask Politics

Military News

Global Politics

Moderate Politics

Progressive Politics

UK Politics

Canadian Politics

Australian Politics

New Zealand Politics

founded 1 year ago
MODERATORS
you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
[–] [email protected] 7 points 1 month ago (2 children)

I mean, this is supposed to be where the distinction between sex and gender comes up. So it'd be incorrect to say trans women are men, but correct (I guess) to say they're male. I don't know, I might be behind the times.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 1 month ago (1 children)

A lot of the distinction of sex and gender gets muddied because as scientific evidence mounted about how blurry the lines between the sexes actually were "gender" ( not as we understand it in a modern queer context) started out as a construct that played fast and loose with phenotype and form to create a scientific construct of sex. It's in part why gender is sometimes a synonym for sex because it was aiming to preserve a biological binary which was really falling apart.

However philosophy looked at that construct and elaborated on what they were seeing and realizing that we draw arbitrary cultural lines around these things so "gender performativity" theory tends to group gender as something you do.

However gender performativity theory doesn't really cover what trans people experience. Basically, a lot of gender dysphoria is actually closer to the original use of gender. It involves people reacting to their physical bodies sex characteristics not falling in line with a sort of internal compulsion...so for a severely compressed example if I feel like everytime I am reminded through language that I do not conform to the physical features typical of the male phenotype I feel depressed, anxious and like essentially life has denied me something essential to me then I can backwards engineer that series of reactions to "I am a man / male"... Man might be a cultural category but the lack of the cultural category isn't what is upsetting, it's the social construct of woman drawing attention to the real problem of existing in my own body.

So where this gets culturally sticky is if someone insisting I am "female" it really is no different then misgendering. What's often culturally happening is they are just trying to do it in a pseudo scientific way which is why people will call you out on it.... Here's where it gets complicated. Trans people are a group of people who are lay masters with personal experience of the malleable nature of physical sex and the science of sex. Since the people often trying to categorize us as "male and female" alone are not actually giving any kind of scientific specificity it's not actually correct in a scientific biology based context so when we say you are wrong we usually don't mean it on a strictly metaphysical axis. We mean, * that's not how science uses those words*.

If I have been on testosterone a while and a couple of surgeries / or if I never went through a feminizing puberty at all I am going to fit more aspects of the male phenotype than female. I might have female chromasomal make up... but chromasomal makeup is only one facet of sex. If you wanted to be actually scientifically correct in regard to the "biological sex" of a trans person then you are going to have to take us on as individuals and that answer is going to be a lot more complicated than just rendering it down to "male" or "female". From a strictly taxonomic perspective a lot of us have become intersex. We biologically fit a category that is beyond the male/ female binary... We just did so as a matter of using technology to achieve that end.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 1 month ago

Thanks for sharing your perspective!

[–] [email protected] 18 points 1 month ago (1 children)

Biology is not that cut and dry. If you medically transition you're somewhere in the middle, and that's important for your healthcare. As in, maybe you need breast cancer checks that you didn't need before, things like that.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 1 month ago (2 children)

Sure, but it's still important for a doctor to know that they're in the middle and weren't, say, born with a uterus. The distinction still matters.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 1 month ago

It is important info for your doctor. But not for politicians, or strangers you avoid eye contact with in a public bathroom.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago)

Of course it matters, if the doctor asks you about your period and you don't have one. But it's the same for AMAB or AFAB people that were born without a uterus, or had it taken out.