this post was submitted on 23 Jul 2024
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446
Title (sh.itjust.works)
submitted 5 months ago by [email protected] to c/[email protected]
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[–] [email protected] 4 points 5 months ago (2 children)

So calling anyone that's liberal but not leftist a blue MAGA isn't a straw man?

No liberal is a leftist, liberalism is right-wing, while leftism is Socialist, of some sort. Additionally, the person you replied to said liberalism itself can be debated, but this specific anti-Leftist liberalism found on Lemmy.world is "Blue MAGA," ie Leftists aren't allowed to complain about whatever right-winger the DNC fronts.

It's intentionally inflammatory and wrong. It sounds like you're being elitist, even if that's not your intention.

I don't see how any of that follows.

I agree that the average US liberal isn't progressive enough and I don't agree with a lot of the liberal circlejerk in these comments, but your argument is just as flawed and cultist.

So you agree with them saying leftists should be allowed to have a voice, but disagree with them saying Lemmy.world liberals are trying to silence Leftists, then "both-sidesing" them? Not sure what you're cooking here.

[–] [email protected] -1 points 5 months ago (1 children)

No liberal is a leftist, liberalism is right-wing

What in the actual fuck are you talking about?

[–] [email protected] 1 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago)

Leftism is Socialist, ie collective ownership of the Means of Production. Rightism is Capitalist, ie individual ownership of the Means of Production.

Liberalism supports Capitalism, ie current system + tweaks, ergo it is right-wing.

[–] [email protected] -3 points 5 months ago (1 children)

No liberal is a leftist, liberalism is right-wing, while leftism is Socialist

That's factually not correct though. I understand and agree there is a difference between leftist and liberal, but the rest is just blatantly wrong.

Here's a history lesson on left and right wing;

https://www.history.com/news/how-did-the-political-labels-left-wing-and-right-wing-originate

Left means progressive, right means traditional. Liberals are progressive and left leaning. Less so in the US, but still not right wing.

Your comment is excluding specific progressives and mislabeling them because they're not as progressive as you. That's what I mean by elitist.

Additionally, no one here is silencing anyone, unless you can pull up some proof that a liberal mod is deleting leftist comments in this thread for being leftist. Everything in these comments is just discussion.

Also, I agree. There are some specify anti-leftist liberal comments here and on Lemmy. That is frustrating and my comments aren't meant to support that, just to point out the hypocrisy I saw. Almost everyone here is anti-fascist and anti-maga, we can be a bit more civil in our disagreements

[–] [email protected] 5 points 5 months ago

That's factually not correct though. I understand and agree there is a difference between leftist and liberal, but the rest is just blatantly wrong.

It is not "blatantly wrong."

Here's a history lesson on left and right wing;

https://www.history.com/news/how-did-the-political-labels-left-wing-and-right-wing-originate

I'm aware.

Left means progressive, right means traditional.

Broadly, yes.

Liberals are progressive and left leaning. Less so in the US, but still not right wing.

Incorrect, entirely. Liberalism is the status quo, ergo it cannot be considered left. Liberalism supports Capitalism and is a right-wing ideology, to be left is to go against that status quo.

Your comment is excluding specific progressives and mislabeling them because they're not as progressive as you. That's what I mean by elitist.

I'm not being "elitist," I am pointing out that Liberalism is not progressive, it's the status quo. I myself am a Marxist, and believe leftism to be correct, but not elite.

Additionally, no one here is silencing anyone, unless you can pull up some proof that a liberal mod is deleting leftist comments in this thread for being leftist. Everything in these comments is just discussion.

In Lemmy.world's modlog, you can find comments and posts removed for being "commie," and Lemmy.world defederates from explicitly Marxist instances.

Also, I agree. There are some specify anti-leftist liberal comments here and on Lemmy. That is frustrating and my comments aren't meant to support that, just to point out the hypocrisy I saw. Almost everyone here is anti-fascist and anti-maga, we can be a bit more civil in our disagreements

It's usally confined to right-leaning instances like Lemmy.world and sh.itjust.works.