this post was submitted on 20 Jun 2024
272 points (89.5% liked)

No Stupid Questions

35780 readers
1188 users here now

No such thing. Ask away!

!nostupidquestions is a community dedicated to being helpful and answering each others' questions on various topics.

The rules for posting and commenting, besides the rules defined here for lemmy.world, are as follows:

Rules (interactive)


Rule 1- All posts must be legitimate questions. All post titles must include a question.

All posts must be legitimate questions, and all post titles must include a question. Questions that are joke or trolling questions, memes, song lyrics as title, etc. are not allowed here. See Rule 6 for all exceptions.



Rule 2- Your question subject cannot be illegal or NSFW material.

Your question subject cannot be illegal or NSFW material. You will be warned first, banned second.



Rule 3- Do not seek mental, medical and professional help here.

Do not seek mental, medical and professional help here. Breaking this rule will not get you or your post removed, but it will put you at risk, and possibly in danger.



Rule 4- No self promotion or upvote-farming of any kind.

That's it.



Rule 5- No baiting or sealioning or promoting an agenda.

Questions which, instead of being of an innocuous nature, are specifically intended (based on reports and in the opinion of our crack moderation team) to bait users into ideological wars on charged political topics will be removed and the authors warned - or banned - depending on severity.



Rule 6- Regarding META posts and joke questions.

Provided it is about the community itself, you may post non-question posts using the [META] tag on your post title.

On fridays, you are allowed to post meme and troll questions, on the condition that it's in text format only, and conforms with our other rules. These posts MUST include the [NSQ Friday] tag in their title.

If you post a serious question on friday and are looking only for legitimate answers, then please include the [Serious] tag on your post. Irrelevant replies will then be removed by moderators.



Rule 7- You can't intentionally annoy, mock, or harass other members.

If you intentionally annoy, mock, harass, or discriminate against any individual member, you will be removed.

Likewise, if you are a member, sympathiser or a resemblant of a movement that is known to largely hate, mock, discriminate against, and/or want to take lives of a group of people, and you were provably vocal about your hate, then you will be banned on sight.



Rule 8- All comments should try to stay relevant to their parent content.



Rule 9- Reposts from other platforms are not allowed.

Let everyone have their own content.



Rule 10- Majority of bots aren't allowed to participate here.



Credits

Our breathtaking icon was bestowed upon us by @Cevilia!

The greatest banner of all time: by @TheOneWithTheHair!

founded 1 year ago
MODERATORS
 

Disclaimer: I am not trolling, I am an autistic person who doesn’t understand so many social nuances. Also I am from New Hampshire (97% white), so I just don’t have any close African-American friends that I am willing to risk asking such a loaded question.

you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
[–] [email protected] 31 points 4 months ago (5 children)

This question reminds me of when that school in NY got in trouble for serving "stereotype food" for black history month.

https://www.cnn.com/2023/02/06/us/aramark-black-history-month-menu-school-reaj/index.html

I have the same confusion as you do, OP. It appears to be a liked dish by all accounts across many races, upbringings, or religions. Unless you have dietary restrictions like Vegan or something.

I'm assuming this is one of the things that racists ruined. Like yeah people like fried chicken, but racist made it a "bad thing." It's kind of like now, you got to look out for the number 88, vikings, the okay sign, the gadsden flag, or punisher flag. It's not that mentioning fried chicken is necessary bad, but people are on edge because Nazi's are back. 1 of the dog whistles might be a coincidence, but you start collecting them and I start side eyeing my co-workers more.

Those damn dog whistles need to end, so we can all enjoy fried chicken and watermelon on Juneteenth.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 4 months ago

Sorry to repost my reply from another thread, I hate to spam up the post but I feel like every American should know about the Minstrel Show

It wasn’t just a form of comedy, it was an entire entertainment industry all on its own, like movie theaters or concerts today. It eventually got replaced by/morphed into Vaudeville (still with blackface/black clowns) which was then replaced by cinema.

For a good 50-100 years, a major form of entertainment (not just in the South btw) was pretty much just: “haha black people are such stupid clowns! Look, that one thinks he’s fancy! That one’s a no-good drunk! Oh look, that one’s trying to give a speech!” It was pretty formulaic with standard props, just like you’d expect to see at a clown show. So fried chicken and watermelon were standard props like “tiny car full of clowns”, oversized shoes, a flower pot for a hat, a flower that squirts water, etc. For that reason they carry a very unpleasant legacy that reminds people of an insult to injury that still hasn’t been made right, in my opinion.

The format was pretty similar to the show Hee-Haw actually, kind of a fun variety show, just wildly racist and it’s obviously pretty fucked up to pick on literal slaves. Real bitch move there.

So people who know something about history are pretty salty about that and forms of the Minstrel Show were still happening here and there recently enough that people alive today remember seeing them.

Irish people caught some shit, but not like that. I’m not sure if Irish-American racism like that happened recently enough that living people remember it, or that it was ever to the extent that it formed an entire entertainment industry.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 4 months ago

There's nothing wrong with fried chicken. There's nothing wrong with watermelon.

But if you're trying to think of menu options for an event associated with black history and you just shrug and think "I dunno, black people like fried chicken and watermelon, so lets do that" you're being so lazy you'd be better off doing nothing at all. I literally typed "black history food" into a search and got many pages with lists of options. So by serving fried chicken and watermelon it's a statement "I don't give a fuck about black people but since I'm obligated to serve some kind of food option I'm just going to stick with lazy stereotypes."

It wold be preferable to do nothing and be honest about not caring than it is to offer a stereotype and then cry crocodile tears because people aren't recognizing the token effort that was made.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 4 months ago

I suppose I'm in a similar situation with ppl in Vermont you don't really get to socialize with people and the few people you come across are never black. Infact I recall actually learning about fried chicken and watermelon being racist from the backlash from the school you just mentioned.

[–] [email protected] 12 points 4 months ago

Don't forget red hats, no more red hats without automatic suspicion... If they have white block text, amplify suspicion by 10,000

[–] [email protected] 14 points 4 months ago (1 children)

This is not targeted at you nor OP.

The answer for both you and OP is tied to your last sentence

so we can all enjoy fried chicken and watermelon on Juneteenth.

Why fried chicken and watermelon and why on Juneteenth? Do you eat fried chicken and watermelon as part of your normal rotation? (Hopefully, 'yes' because both are delicious and everyone should be afforded the opportunity to indulge)

The issue is that very evidently in both OP's case and the one you linked that someone was given the prompts "food for celebration" and "celebration of African Americans", generated "African American party foods", and churned out a menu reinforcing racist stereotypes. The inquiry is "hey, where is your head at?"

[–] [email protected] 8 points 4 months ago (1 children)

I mean I get that. I just don't personally see it as that. I do eat fried chicken and watermelon (and other soul food like greens, sweet potatoes, etc). I don't eat them as much as I want because the places around me don't make good soul food anymore. The quality is down in my opinion.

I mentioned the day because all holiday celebrations include food. I also mentioned in my opinion, that everyone loves that type of food. I just didn't think of it as "black food" but I know it is stereotypically a trope. I think this understanding of other people's racist tropes and my love of celebrating with loved ones and good food is where I (and assuming OP) is coming from.

Is the main issue the intent? If you eat corned beef for St Paddy's or carne asada for Cinco de Mayo is that an issue? If we ask black people what we should eat for Black History Month or Juneteenth and they agreed that soul food is good then is it okay? Should we just stick to burgers and dogs like it's the 4th of July?

I feel we can never really have these conversations (IRL) because people assume what the other person means when they are trying to understand the reason behind it.

All that to say, we have to be extra vigilant because racists are everywhere pushing their agenda, so I understand that this trope could be insulting to some. I've also met black people that don't give it a second thought because the food is good and they were hungry.

[–] [email protected] 8 points 4 months ago (1 children)

Juneteenth is coalescing around a menu of barbeque and red colored foods. Fried chicken could be served, but it likely wouldn't be the main entree.

It would be like a non-American serving Americans burgers and fries for Thanksgiving. Sure, Americans are known to like burgers, but that isn't the holiday is about.

[–] [email protected] -1 points 4 months ago (1 children)

I know this whole celebration of Juneteenth is new, so the foods will take some time to become official. BBQ and red food is just as good as any other made up meal, in my opinion.

I wish we focused more on black (or at least local) owned businesses for Juneteenth. Of course, holidays get commercialized like crazy, so I'm sure some businesses will pander too much and make a fool of themselves.

On a side note, I heard Japan celebrates Christmas with KFC. Apparently that's the idea that got sold to Japan for how Americans celebrate Christmas. I wouldn't be surprised if some countries think Americans eat burgers and fries for Thanksgiving.

https://www.timeout.com/tokyo/things-to-do/whats-the-deal-with-kfc-and-christmas-in-japan

[–] [email protected] 6 points 4 months ago (1 children)

just as good as any other made up meal, in my opinion.

You may not see a significance in a holiday meal, but others do. There is a reason why most civilizations include traditional foods to holidays.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 4 months ago (1 children)

I just meant what the food was didn't matter. It was having a good to come together around and share in the togetherness.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 4 months ago

Apparently the food does matter.