this post was submitted on 08 Nov 2024
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[–] [email protected] 39 points 2 weeks ago (8 children)

Way more than two options here.

I voted for Harris, and I encouraged others to as well. And I think the Democratic leadership royally fucked up here.

The polls kinda sucked in the end, and I think one reason is that folks were embarrassed to admit they were voting for Trump. That to me says that they voted for him not because he's a racist sexist pig, but in spite of this.

But the polls did afaik get that the economy was hugely important. And the Democrats failed here both in current policy (groceries got more expensive over the course of Biden's term), and in proposed policy messaging. No one cares about home buyer credits if you can't afford groceries. (And no, I don't think Trump has a plan to lower prices aside from shady back room deals that will ultimately cost us big


but voters want something new...)

To be clear, I voted for Biden, I voted for Harris, and I'm pretty scared about the future. But the Democrats need to learn something from this or it's same story in four years. Maybe the lesson is "we can't count on the left in this country to vote for us by default," and maybe the lesson is, "for the love of God raise hell if the cost of living goes up, and do it in a way that appeals to the lowest common denominator."

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[–] [email protected] 91 points 2 weeks ago (7 children)

Are we, the Democratic party out of touch?

No, it's the electorate's fault!

[–] [email protected] 6 points 2 weeks ago

Honestly, if they do the same things next cycle, I'll be more inclined to vote green.

[–] [email protected] 25 points 2 weeks ago (3 children)

Nobody is arguing the DNC isn't out of touch.

however the electorate isn't much better. Cutting off their nose to spite their face.

Nice try on the strawman though, better than some.

[–] [email protected] 12 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

What strawman? When is it appropriate to hold DNC leadership accountable for losing the election, again?

[–] [email protected] 8 points 2 weeks ago (2 children)

The DNC will have its come to jesus moment and maybe come to the wrong conclusions again, but it's still patently obvious that a massive number of people will vote against their own interests regardless of the arguments anyone made.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 2 weeks ago

Yeah it’s hard to vote in an informed manner with so many obstacles to education. I suspect this problem is about to get a whole lot worse unfortunately.

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[–] [email protected] 30 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

I am not here to argue. I will not engage beyond this post no matter what is said in response because I don't want to fight.

What matters is policy. Real hard on the ground policy that real normal people can feel and see where they live.

When some wonk gets on MSNBC with a spreadsheet hooting about how much better things are with grocery prices or housing costs, that doesn't mean anything to someone who's begging for extra shifts at work so they can make rent. Those are aggregates and averages. If the 200k-500k bracket is doing better while the 13k-45k bracket isnt, the numbers still went up. That looks better in the data. But the people at the bottom are still suffering just as much as ever. They don't feel or see any improvement because there wasn't any. Not for them.

The health and performance of the stock market only matters to those on the bottom when it crashes and suddenly they're paying more for everything. At no other point does it impact them in the slightest. Those record profits aren't reinvested, they're not used to reduce the strain on consumers. Its gobbled up by a few dozen shareholders. It benefits nobody else. And if an executive or CEO has the slightest semblance of a soul and wants to help consumers they're voted out because the only responsibility is to those few dozen shareholders.

Healthcare. The ACA was a grand achievement. They took Romneycare national. Round of applause for all involved. But its still cheaper to do some form of Universal Healthcare. That would be the easiest win in history. And everyone would feel it immediately. It would help 100,000,000 people immediately. People who have been putting off medical treatment for half their lives because of the extortionist expense would immediately seek treatment. They would seek preventative treatment and raise the overall health across the country. Obesity rates drop, drug use plummets, etc.

Marijuana. Literally every person I know and interact with in my daily life uses it. Do you know the number one reason I've heard from all of them? Pain management. Again, another easy win that is supported by everyone except the ghouls who were alive when it was called "The Devil's Lettuce" and propagandized into believing its this terrible thing.

Hard Policy that people can feel and see in their daily lives. You can still court the comfortable liberals who care about the stock market and all that. They'll be fine no matter who is in office. If they need an abortion it's a weekend vacay to Zurich or somewhere. But you're never going to hold any meaningful power again without hard policy. Because for decades now the republicans have cornered the market on grievance politics and reaction. To break through that you need something real. No more vibes based nonsense. It will not work.

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[–] [email protected] 62 points 2 weeks ago (4 children)

Harris ran a perfect campaign. If she was running as a (pre-Trump) republican. However, we know that:

  1. She isn't a Republican
  2. She banked on pulling in republican voters, instead of rallying her base
  3. Republicans will almost always vote for the R instead of policy
  4. She backed off of every single progressive idea she started with
  5. She trotted out establishment Democrats to lecture the electorate instead of inspire them
  6. Tlaib pulled twice the numbers as Harris as the only anti-genocide Palestinian in Congress

It's Harris and the Democrats. Should people have voted? Yes. Is it understandable why people didn't want to vote for the person telling them that she'll be a good republican and support a genocide? Also yes.

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