this post was submitted on 01 Nov 2024
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Science Memes

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[–] [email protected] 17 points 3 weeks ago* (last edited 3 weeks ago) (2 children)

No, you don't understand, this is all communist propaganda! /j

[–] [email protected] 16 points 3 weeks ago

Yes, octomom has a baby.

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[–] [email protected] 20 points 3 weeks ago (17 children)

I thought everyone knew this. Tasks based on sex were not so prevalent until high cultures formed and people started settling down instead of being nomadic.

[–] [email protected] 14 points 3 weeks ago

Not just nomadic. Many sedentary societies lack strong gender divisions in labor as well.

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[–] [email protected] 9 points 3 weeks ago (1 children)

I grew up in Da Yoop. In my high school, our head cheer leader was an expert bow hunter. This "discovery" is not in any way a surprise to me.

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[–] [email protected] 1 points 3 weeks ago (2 children)

My SO has a theory that if the group of people lived in a harsh environment, ie. having to work for what you had with no guarantee of food or safety, etc, it was common for women to work just as much as men. Such a society needed all hands on deck, so to speak. But, when we start becoming "civilized", and things started getting made for us, (as opposed to an individual making it themselves.) Women and men start having diverging roles. Essentially, there's just not enough work, so womens role turns into raising the babies, to fill the time. Eventually, for whatever reason, "civilized" society just forgot about the hard times and assumes women have always been there just to raise babies.

Disclaimer: This is based on absolutely nothing. Maybe some random information that explain that women did "men" jobs too, once. Idk.

[–] [email protected] 8 points 3 weeks ago (1 children)

I promise you that there remains 'enough work' in early sedentary societies. The work, in fact, is endless - moreso than in a hunter-gatherer society, which is more reliant on circumstance than labor.

Divergence of roles seems to be connected to control of social power. As men come to dominate one sphere (typically warfare, since the average woman in the pre-modern period is intermittently disadvantaged in that by several months of pregnancy numerous times throughout her life), that power imbalance is used to strip power from women in other spheres (social, economic, sexual, etc).

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[–] [email protected] 2 points 3 weeks ago (1 children)

It's called the neolithic revolution.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 3 weeks ago* (last edited 3 weeks ago)

Crap. They just took it from somewhere else and passed it off as their own. Jerk.

Edit: But then why is this even being debated?

[–] [email protected] 14 points 3 weeks ago (1 children)

In any way all of those are just speculations, it's very hard to be sure about anything when you go more than 10000 years back in time, all I know is that in school they teach mostly lies

[–] [email protected] 11 points 3 weeks ago (2 children)

Personally I find it weird that we do generalities about a this population as it is very likely that they had all different cultures on the tribe level.

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[–] [email protected] 9 points 3 weeks ago (1 children)

That's why when you see documentaries about tribes that had little to no contact to the outside world, women are often hunting and do the heavy lifting and men are at home raising kids and taking care of the village while the women are out there. I mean i haven't seen it, but according to this one weird paper they must exist.

[–] [email protected] 11 points 3 weeks ago* (last edited 3 weeks ago) (1 children)
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[–] [email protected] 14 points 3 weeks ago (2 children)

Would be a nice plot twist, but do you habe any sources for your claim? If this is real I would like to know more

[–] [email protected] 4 points 3 weeks ago (1 children)

Check out "The Dawn of Everything" by Wengrow and Graeber

[–] [email protected] 5 points 3 weeks ago (2 children)

Different point of view on your “source”, which is a mass market paperback made to sell and be consumed, not for serious scientific inquiry.

https://libcom.org/article/wrong-about-almost-everything-review-dawn-everything-david-graeber-david-wengrow

[–] [email protected] 5 points 3 weeks ago* (last edited 3 weeks ago) (1 children)

This author is a crackpot that also went after Chomsky. Chomsky had a hilarious rebuttal from what I remember. He really has a thing for anarchists. I'll trust these critics more when they do published rebuttals. I'm pretty sure several chapters in this book were published in some journals.

[–] [email protected] 5 points 3 weeks ago (1 children)

Yeah it's a summary work that draws on decades of research. Both of these authors are extremely well-published in their respective fields. I'm like a third of the way through Dawn of Everything and it's just as academic as "Debt" was, and neither are mass-market pulp. But work like this always draws hit pieces because it's a way for critics to get their name out there.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 3 weeks ago* (last edited 3 weeks ago)

Yeah, that critic made a career on doing hit pieces. I also find it unconvincing lmao.

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[–] [email protected] 17 points 3 weeks ago* (last edited 3 weeks ago) (3 children)

https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC10306201/

This paper has a lot of back and forth. Another commenter posted a rebuttal.

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[–] [email protected] 32 points 3 weeks ago (1 children)

I urge everyone to look up the book Invisible Women by Caroline Criado Perez. The cultural patriarchy is crazy.

Nobody questions how archeology is influenced by contemporary culture. When archeologists find a grave and goes "the body is buried with weapons and a shield, therefore it must be a warrior and thus a man. And they still fucking note how it's weird that this definitely-a-man is smaller than other men from this culture, and his hips are wide, almost like a woman... But he's a dude, he's got weapons after all!" smh

[–] [email protected] 12 points 3 weeks ago

I got the audiobook and I couldn’t finish it. I just couldn’t. I felt so much anger.

But what I managed to get through was fantastic. The part about public transport during winter was so eye opening.

[–] [email protected] 55 points 3 weeks ago (2 children)

This study this meme is based on is completely incorrect and should be retracted. Here's a lay summary of its issues:

https://whyevolutionistrue.com/2024/03/04/new-paper-debunks-the-prevalence-of-women-hunting-in-early-societies/

And the published article detailing the problems with that study's issues:

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S1090513824000497

[–] [email protected] 10 points 3 weeks ago* (last edited 3 weeks ago) (1 children)

I remember reading this simply terrible article in Scientific American; the entire article was based on this research paper referred to the meme above.

The paper was a complete fraud, and people just guzzled the cool-aid. He'll they still do, looking at this thread.

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[–] [email protected] 6 points 3 weeks ago (1 children)

To say it's "completely incorrect" is an exaggeration at best. The paper you cited is far more nuanced than that.

[–] [email protected] 16 points 3 weeks ago

A bit of an exaggeration, sure. But only a bit. The lay summary of the article I referenced states the following:

Venkataraman et al. find that the paper commits every error that it was possible to make in the paper: leaving out important papers, including irrelevant papers, using duplicate papers, mis-coding their societies, getting the wrong values for “big” versus “small” game, and many others.

"commits every error that it was possible to make in the paper," and, "completely incorrect," aren't very different.

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