this post was submitted on 07 Dec 2023
20 points (85.7% liked)

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Linus does not fuck around (lemmy.one)
submitted 9 months ago by [email protected] to c/[email protected]
122 comments fedilink hide all child comments
 

An oldie, but a goodie

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[–] [email protected] 0 points 9 months ago (1 children)

It's disgusting that this post has not been removed, has a 96% postive vote ratio, has over 1K upvotes and is sitting at the top of All after almost a day.

This isn't a Linux meme. It's a celebration of abuse, abusive behaviour and abusive people.

All the people ITT condoning or making even the slightest accommodations for this behaviour ought to be ashamed and need to take a good, long look in a mirror.

What are the moderators of this community thinking? Are you reading this stuff? Do some of you agree with any of it?

Of all the things to celebrate about Linus and Linux this is not one of them.

There is no value in leaving this post up. There is nothing to be learned or gained by revealing just how gross some supposed Linux supporters may be.

Does anyone ITT seriously think this is how Linus or Linux developers want to be remembered and celebrated for their dedication and decades of toil?

Do you think anyone that's been on the receiving end of this kind of abuse on the job or in the home wants to jump onto Lemmy today to see this celebration of abusive and awful behaviour.

There are no excuses to be made. It doesn't matter that this happened many years ago and that Linus has managed to overcome behaving like this. The post itself is now the issue.

The many comments that have made even the slightest excuse for this kind of behaviour are awful and damaging to the reputations of Linus, Linux and the Linux community.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) (1 children)

While Linus went overboard (as he has a history of doing, and as has also caused negativity to the community), this post is still very well liked because it appears to be a strong example of someone calling out the BS that a lot of developers like to throw around. No one's going to join in a circle celebrating Linus picking on some first time contributor who didn't know any better, but that's how it sounds like you're interpreting the post.

To add some context, there's a toxic superiority complex that many developers have where they jump to blame others for issues that actually relate to their code. You can see this anywhere from developers who immediately blame users without investigating to software developers within companies who are quick to pass off issues as not their team's problem.

So, in this example Linus is actually calling one of these developers out, which is why the post is very well-received.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 9 months ago (1 children)

Well put

[–] [email protected] -1 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) (1 children)

You mean the light isn't properly aligned?

[–] [email protected] 0 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) (1 children)

Wat? I mean the point was written in easy to ubderstand way. It is picture of point from TF2.

[–] [email protected] -1 points 9 months ago

I still do not understand how Dustbowl's point has anything to do with conveying that meaning but whatever I do not care.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago)

Ugh, having been on the receiving end, this type of belittlement is the worst, and breeds resentment, factionalism, and a host of other toxic elements in the workplace.

Irrespective of the validity of his critique, prima donna developers are the worst and I would start looking for jobs elsewhere because programming is already stressful enough, don't want to start worrying about the people.

[–] [email protected] -1 points 9 months ago (3 children)

Honestly, I maybe get why some people are too sensitive to work in such conditions, but from my professional experience, I’d much rather prefer getting angry mail explaining why my actions are stupid, than everyone being nice to one another but the codebase is utter garbage and everything falls apart, which happens a lot in private companies.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 9 months ago (1 children)

you seem to have created a false dichotomy where it's impossible to fix bad code without being abusive. would you like me to call you "dumb motherfucker" or is this explanation enough?

[–] [email protected] 0 points 9 months ago (1 children)

I think you've missed what the sin was, as well as the context of the players.

The sin was not the bad code. Let me say it one more time for clarity: the issue was not the code

The issue was that, when presented with the defect (inevitable outcome of any software project: not intrinsically sinful) Mauro started blaming other people on a public mailing list

Mauro, being a maintainer, was in a position of authority. Like a police officer, their bad behaviour reflected poorly on the organization*as a whole.

If a cop was abusing their power (publicly or not), I expect the chief of police to come down on that abuser; to make clear that this abuse is absolutely unacceptable, not only within the accute instance, but within the greater context of the expectation of the behaviour of the whole organization.

Mauro chose the context of his abusive behaviour as the public mailing list.

Him getting slapped down in that same forum is the direct result of his own choices.

In the same way that I would be upset with the chief of police not publicly and harshy denouncing an abusive police officer, so would I be upset with the absence of such a response in this situation

[–] [email protected] 1 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago)

I didn't miss the sin. The sin isn't relevant to me. You don't treat people like that. Whatever you hope to accomplish, you can accomplish without treating people like that. If someone else is being abusive, that's not license for you to be abusive in response. If a cop was abusing their power would you expect the chief of police to publicly berate and insult him, or would you expect the standards to be enforced without resorting to that?

When you abuse someone for being abusive you don't make it clear that abuse is unacceptable. In fact, you do the opposite. You establish that abuse is a part of your culture. If I was considering contributing to the kernel and saw this exchange, I'd walk away. I don't need that shit, not from Mauro, not from Linus, not from the Lord hisownself. It damages the organization long-term.

[–] [email protected] -1 points 9 months ago

Or nice in person, then all the toxic bakstabbing behind the scenes.
This reads like the Sh*t My Dad says book. The author said it seemed harsh to some people, but the bonus was there was never any passive agressiveness, and you always knew exactly where you stood.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 9 months ago (1 children)

What if I told you that you can have constructive discussions without being verbally abusive?

[–] [email protected] -1 points 9 months ago

I would tell you that you haven't worked with enough people. I don't disagree but occasionally you find people that need a really really good reminder that they not only suck but you've tried to be nice multiple times and it didn't penetrate.

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