I don't!
this post was submitted on 26 Dec 2023
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Coming at him with a personal insult is not the way to go about this.
The correct way is to point out that most Christmas traditions are not rooted in Christianity, but in paganism.
Exactly. What is Christian about chopping down an evergreen and put it in your house? That's a pre-christian fertility symbol to invoke the turn of the solar year and the next agricultural season.
Also, the man is an idiot.
Nah, simple facts don't work on people like Sorbo. Insults don't really work either, but at least that's funnier.
As far as I can tell, the traditions that surround Christmas have nothing to do with Christianity. Basically most of the stuff was coopted by Christianity at some point from some other belief or religion.
There's no mention of putting up lights or a tree or giving presents to eachother as part of celebrating Jesus' "birthday" (which all evidence would suggest, was not in December).
So I would ask, what's particularly Christian about Christmas trees, lights and decorations, as well as gift giving at Christmas time? What part of the Bible says that's what you're supposed to do?
Simply put, it's not in the Bible.
So I really have up wonder about anyone who criticises an atheist (or literally any non-Christian) about "celebrating" Christmas, since all the traditional stuff about Christmas has nothing to do with Christianity.
Obvious exception for Christmas mass or whatever religious service is happening the same day as Christmas.... Going to a church is literally the only Christian thing about Christmas that Christians do.... Everything else is simply "tradition" which has no basis in the Bible.
People like Sorbo are over here trying to gate keep celebrating the holidays.
And it isn't just the traditions that are borrowed, but the date too. As you said, the 25th of December wasn't Jesus' birthday - but it apparently was the birthday of Sol Invictus. (i.e. the sun.)
What to the more on all that. Xmas is basically just late to the picture as the real holiday is already over on Xmas eve.
The real bit to celebrate regardless of religion, or even, if not especially, the lackthereof, is that this is the day of the return to the sun in the Earth's ellipse of varying distance from such.
Actually there is a possible Bible reference to the Three Magi who brought gifts to baby Jesus, some Christian traditions refer to this for gift giving instead of Christmas.
The so called "three Wise Men" or whatever. Yep.
IMO that's a bit of a flimsy argument. Jesus' family got gifts on his birthday, so everyone should participate in unrestricted consumerism because Jesus.
..... Almost everyone celebrates their birthday with gift giving. Why then, in this case, does it constitute that everyone should give stuff to their friends/family/etc? "It's someone else's birthday, so I got you a gift!" What? Why?
The logic is insane.
Why do you expect perfect logic from religious practice and other rituals (ex: national celebrations)? They are just made to strengthen the ties between people. It makes people happy to receive gifts because it makes them feel valued. Consumerism is a phenomenon that adds to this but it's not specific to religious rituals, it is everywhere. Kids used to just receive simple stuff like oranges.
When people take part in Christmas: "Stop enjoying our holiday!!"
When people don't: "They're waging a war on Christmas!!"
Victimhood is their chosen drug...
Why do Christians buy "Christmas" trees when they're explicitly forbidden?
Jeremiah 10:1-5
1 Hear ye the word which the Lord speaketh unto you, O house of Israel: 2 Thus saith the Lord, Learn not the way of the heathen, and be not dismayed at the signs of heaven; for the heathen are dismayed at them. 3 For the customs of the people are vain: for one cutteth a tree out of the forest, the work of the hands of the workman, with the axe. 4 They deck it with silver and with gold; they fasten it with nails and with hammers, that it move not. 5 They are upright as the palm tree, but speak not: they must needs be borne, because they cannot go. Be not afraid of them; for they cannot do evil, neither also is it in them to do good.
If you try googling any of this, you will find a shit ton of christian cope. Reminder, the Christmas tree started as a winter solstice pagan holiday.
If you try googling any of this, you will find a shit ton of christian cope
"Cope" is basically the foundation of most religions.
Mostly because 90% of what's in The Bible is gobblederemoved, twisted and contorted by a wide variety of opportunistic con men over the course of thousands of years, written in such a vague way as to easily be interpreted to mean whatever they want it to mean.
Similar to the way Trump speaks in vague generalities and word salad, and people hear whatever they want to hear, which of course leads to massive problems when you're the leader or aspiring leader of the free world.
Basically. I once overheard an explanation of the holy trinity and I just couldn't figure out how anyone could be satisfied with it. They just exhaust the listener with nonsense until they give in.
I thought the Christmas tree started relatively recently, around the Renaissance.
the Christmas tree started as a winter solstice pagan holiday.
I'd always heard that too, but Religion for breakfast put out a pretty interesting breakdown on why that may likely not be the case.
Honestly, given that they are using a narrow definition of specifically an evergreen being decorated I don't agree. I'm not sure why we wouldn't include other types of winter holiday trees or bushes like the ones decorated for Saturnalia. There's also a lot of "probably" and supposition in this video.
Interesting.
Oh yes, because xmas trees, Santa and reindeer are heavy themes in the Bible....
To me Xmas is not a religious event. The midnight mass is religious. But the whole bit with Santa, the tree, and the presents. No.
Also Jesus was born during tax season, not the winter solstice.
Santa died for our sins
You didn't hear it from me, but word on the street is Jesus faked his death and has been living under the false identity of Santa.