this post was submitted on 07 Apr 2024
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TechTakes

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Big brain tech dude got yet another clueless take over at HackerNews etc? Here's the place to vent. Orange site, VC foolishness, all welcome.

This is not debate club. Unless it’s amusing debate.

For actually-good tech, you want our NotAwfulTech community

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Have a sneer percolating in your system but not enough time/energy to make a whole post about it? Go forth and be mid!

Any awful.systems sub may be subsneered in this subthread, techtakes or no.

If your sneer seems higher quality than you thought, feel free to cut’n’paste it into its own post, there’s no quota for posting and the bar really isn’t that high

The post Xitter web has spawned soo many “esoteric” right wing freaks, but there’s no appropriate sneer-space for them. I’m talking redscare-ish, reality challenged “culture critics” who write about everything but understand nothing. I’m talking about reply-guys who make the same 6 tweets about the same 3 subjects. They’re inescapable at this point, yet I don’t see them mocked (as much as they should be)
Like, there was one dude a while back who insisted that women couldn’t be surgeons because they didn’t believe in the moon or in stars? I think each and every one of these guys is uniquely fucked up and if I can’t escape them, I would love to sneer at them.

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[–] [email protected] 0 points 9 months ago (1 children)
[–] [email protected] 0 points 9 months ago (1 children)

this was of course the toast of the UK press and Twitter

they're doing a parody of it in LA, which looks like rubbish but they're flying over the Oompa Loompa actor so if she gets a paying gig out of it then fine

[–] [email protected] 0 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) (1 children)

This is the worst timeline.

But if this is the actor's break then hey I agree something good comes out of it.

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[–] [email protected] 0 points 9 months ago (3 children)

404 media revisited the worthless DeepMind materials science dataset, featuring some world-class marketing gymnastics:

Google DeepMind told me in a statement, “We stand by all claims made in Google DeepMind’s GNoME paper.”

“Our GNoME research represents orders of magnitude more candidate materials than were previously known to science, and hundreds of the materials we’ve predicted have already been independently synthesized by scientists around the world,” it added.

[…]

Google said that some of the criticisms in the Chemical Materials analysis, like the fact that many of the new materials have already known structures but use different elements, were done by DeepMind by design.

hundreds of the materials have already been independently synthesized you say?

”We spent quite a lot of time on this going through a very small subset of the things that they propose and we realize not only was there no functionality, but most of them might be credible, but they’re not very novel because they’re simple derivatives of things that are already known.”

this just in, DeepMind’s output is worthless by design. but about that credibility point…

“In the DeepMind paper there are many examples of predicted materials that are clearly nonsensical. Not only to subject experts, but most high school students could say that compounds like H2O11 (which is a Deepmind prediction) do not look right,” Palgrave told me.

by far the most depressing part of this article is that all of the scientists involved go to some lengths to defend this bullshit — every criticism is hedged with a “but we don’t hate AI and Google’s technology is still probably revolutionary, we swear!” and I don’t know if that’s due to AI companies attributing the successes of machine learning in research to unrelated LLM and generative AI tech (a form of reputation laundering they do constantly) or because the scientists in question are afraid of getting their lab’s cloud compute credits yanked if they’re too critical. knowing the banality of the technofascist evil in play at Google, it’s probably both.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) (2 children)

While the above analysis may seem to be critical, we do believe that many of our points could be adopted in the next version of this work. More scrutiny of the “new” materials needs to be performed prior to putting them into a database and claiming “...an order-of-magnitude expansion in stable materials known to humanity”. In fact, we have yet to find any strikingly novel compounds in the GNoME and Stable Structure listings, although we anticipate that there must be some among the 384,870 compositions.

This brings us to our final point concerning the claim of “an order-of-magnitude expansion in stable materials known to humanity”. We would respectfully suggest that the work by Merchant et al. (1) does not report any new materials but reports a list of proposed compounds. In our view, a compound can be called a material when it exhibits some functionality and, therefore, has potential utility. Since no functionality has been demonstrated for the 384,870 compositions in the Stable Structure database, they cannot yet be regarded as materials.

then they proceed to explain how badly have they fucked up in the only one example where they tried to find some utility of "new" "material"

The few examples of functionality mentioned in the article are associated with Li+-ion conductors. While the proposed materials are encouraging, their compositions leave much to be desired since they incorporate chemically soft anions. These anions are usually associated with narrow electrochemical stability windows, which renders materials that incorporate them somewhat pointless as Li+ solid electrolytes. (29)

this is basically closest you can get to "you fucked up, do better" in a published article. saying "you fucked up, actually don't even try to do better, go home" is not what i've seen ever really in published piece, excluding obvious cases of cooked data, even if it's warranted this time. it's in conclusions section https://pubs.acs.org/doi/10.1021/acs.chemmater.4c00643

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[–] [email protected] 0 points 9 months ago

it's really the "i'm doing 1000 calculations per second and they are all wrong" meme in machine form

[–] [email protected] 0 points 9 months ago

so that preprint got published. good

[–] [email protected] 0 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) (3 children)

Long time lurker, first time sneerer reporting for duty.

e/acc got the spotlight in an article on the Australian public broadcaster, and I couldn't help myself.

In many ways, he's a perfect fit for the movement. But despite sharing many e/acc values, he's not willing to call himself one. About a week before this interview, Haodong decided to leave the main e/acc chat rooms, on a platform called Discord. "First things first. It's a cesspit," he says. "They have a high tolerance towards, very, very far right people and trolls." The final straw came, he says, when someone was advancing an anti-Semitic conspiracy theory that an evil Jewish cabal was trying to wipe out western civilisation. It's true that sexism, racism and general bigotry are regular features in the forum. "I don't want to be associated with a lot of these guys. They're very extreme libertarian kooks."

[–] [email protected] 0 points 9 months ago

This journo: "Hmm, a guy that was deeply in this community says it's a fucked up shithole with bad politics. I'm going to ignore that aspect of it and just uncritically platform them wholesale"

[–] [email protected] 0 points 9 months ago

The thermodynamic god is a kind of in-joke for e/acc; a reference to the laws of physics

But apparently asking a physicist whether these people are all full of shit is too much.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 9 months ago (2 children)

welcome! this is a good first post.

"Ever since I was a kid, I wanted to figure out a theory of everything, to understand the universe."

It turned out the real Beff Jezos was a brilliant Quantum AI computing scientist.

He's only in his early 30s, but he'd already held leadership roles at two cutting-edge companies owned by Google's parent company, Alphabet.

and I can see why you needed to sneer. the entire fucking article quirkwashes e/a and BasedBeffJezos by sharing some of the absolute stupidest opinions and memes ever formed (an e/a staple) and a small fraction of the bigotry in their community, and handwaves it all away by claiming BasedBeffJezos must be a genius cause he was a nepo hire at two google subsidiaries and was a “Quantum AI computing scientist”, whatever the fuck that means

Despite the apparent war, e/accs and doomers have a surprising amount in common.

wow, it’s almost like your ass forgot to interview anyone outside of an AI cult for this article

[–] [email protected] 0 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) (3 children)

thanks! I've been enjoying the weekly threads, feels like they provide an easier way to get involved.

I thought at the end of the article they'd provide a modicum of push back by sharing the perspective of someone outside the cult, but nope, they round it out with a "self-professed doomer" EA, who they introduce as (and only as):

the co-founder of a global accessories brand called Bellroy, Matt's a successful Australian entrepreneur.

Objection, relevance?

[–] [email protected] 0 points 9 months ago

the co-founder of a global accessories brand called Bellroy,

fuck now I gotta burn my bellroy shit.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 9 months ago

Bellroy stuff is kind of in my wheelhouse for minimalist manly man stuff; luckily I haven't bought any.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 9 months ago

nvm found the relevance, Linkedin tells me he was involved in hosting Lesswrong for 9 years lol

[–] [email protected] 0 points 9 months ago (2 children)

when I asked BasedBeffJezos what I should expect from an e/a future, he replied “welcome to the fantasy zone. get ready !”. it was only then that I realized he had cleverly tricked me into interviewing a standup cabinet of the 1985 Sega arcade hit Space Harrier

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[–] [email protected] 0 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago)

Grimes popping back into the sneerstream reminded me about that time Janelle Monáe demonstrated how sexy robot songs can be good actually.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oFK6k-pvXmI

[–] [email protected] 0 points 9 months ago (5 children)

got this over IM, apparently a twitter is making SM-Civ into a cognitohazard. must be a slow news day

[–] [email protected] 0 points 9 months ago (1 children)

This is a bit meta but the fact that this Black Horse guy got his thread recommended by the algo seems to imply he's a bluechecker but there's none visible. So the question is if he is hiding it, and if it will be revealed by the latest ukase from St. Elon that hiding the blue check is no longer possible...

[–] [email protected] 0 points 9 months ago

flipside: the content is definitely a type of topic that elmo wants to amplify, could be amplified under that too?

[–] [email protected] 0 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) (1 children)

I skimmed this thread and OOP is mad that you can beat Civ without literally conquering the world, a change which may have been made for balance and depth; but ig its just another attempt by the soiboi elites to longhouse gamers

Edit: whoops, turns out everyone wrote my comment but better. Have an unhinged quote retweet instead

[–] [email protected] 0 points 9 months ago (1 children)

Dunno about that edit, “soibot elites” is a hell of a contribution in sneer commentary :D

[–] [email protected] 0 points 9 months ago (1 children)

my Soiboi Elite is my favorite gaming mouse

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[–] [email protected] 0 points 9 months ago (1 children)

Once, when I was ~21, I got embarrassed at a viewing of RHPS because I told the floor show people, "oh, I've seen Rocky Horror lots, like, 5 or 6 times!" 5 or 6 viewings is, in the context of RHPS, not even remotely "lots".

Anyway imagine having opinions about Civ and bragging, "I have replayed each civilization game at least once from beginning to end".

[–] [email protected] 0 points 9 months ago

Also imagine being an anti-woke fall-of-civilization twat and also being angry at the introduction of the great people game mechanic.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) (3 children)

that thread is quite nuts, as his main complaint is some sort of 'you can no longer take over the world as easily' thing, while civilization always had anti-snowballing mechanics. (He also doesn't mention the spinoffs like alpha centauri, colonization and call to power, which (apart from call to power I think) should be part of the conversation as they were created by the same teams/software houses as the civs at the time. But the changes in those games would undermine his message of 'ruling class (?? Firaxis ruling class really??) cultural decline'. And not just a higher focus on different game mechanics because they want every game to have a distinct different felling to try and get new people involved, the market has changed and pure 1991 style civilization games don't do as well and don't recoup your budget. The problem also seems to be that he is a 'conquerer' type player while civ tries to also appeal to the 'builder' type players, and I think more modern civs also try to appeal to the 'multiplayer' type player which is in conflict with the 'conquerer' type. (I made the specific types up here, but there are general types of players, and somebody interested in a 'clash of civilizations I want to take over the world' type of game is going to want a different type of game than a 'clash of civilizations I want to build the best civ' game or a 'clash of civilizations, I want to play a game with my friends' game).

This thread feels like a shapiro, and I have only glanced at game design theory as an amateur.

Edit: sorry my comment is obviously bad as I didn't first replay all the civ games before making this comment. ;) But if I had, I would remember that in the first game you could 'win' the game by building a spaceship to alpha centauri, as the game was score based (I think a successful big spaceship gave a massive score boost), not 'win by taking out all other empires' based (which iirc just ends the game, aka he confused completing a game with winning a game). In civ1 you don't play against others, you play against your earlier self via the high score system.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 9 months ago (1 children)

Also any hardcore Civ player will tell you that full conquest is basically the only possible win strategy on Diety (the highest difficulty level), because the AI gets such sick bonuses to all stats that you can't compete on science or anything else. Conquest is literally the meta!

Honestly, I am more disgusted by this guy's bad takes about Civ than the reactionary talking points. If you want to be an obnoxious white gamer dude at least do it correctly you piece of shit.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 9 months ago

I almost never play full conquest, honestly. And in Civ VI I find I actually have to make an effort to avoid winning on religion, because the game's AI is so dumb about how to do a religious war. But generally I like to alternate different victory conditions and try to win with a different one each time I play.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 9 months ago

In Civilization: Beyond Earth you can literally become an imperialist Earth puritanian faction whose agenda is eradicating all native life and colonising the planet.

Woke?

[–] [email protected] 0 points 9 months ago (1 children)

For example, in Civ V you can only play peaceful flower-smelling whimpy-ass woke hippies, like Askia

[–] [email protected] 0 points 9 months ago

[Insert urban legend Nuclear Gandhi joke here]

[–] [email protected] 0 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) (1 children)

Because I am a glutton for punishment I found the unrolled thread here (via HN but they don't have anything to say apart from complaining you have to be logged on to Twitter to read it).

All I'm gonna say is that if you're coming after me with a thesis about the Fall of the West, you'd better not have apostrophes in your possessive its.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 9 months ago (1 children)

Which is kind of funny to me because compared to games like CK2 that focus on a specific part of history Civ's application of a single set of unified mechanics to the whole of human history ends up creating a kind of state realism that is not without political implications of its own. Like, Civilization is a series in which the entirety of human history is described in terms of a competition with explicit winners and losers between entities with strictly defined borders and policies enforced within them, i.e. nation-states. It's not a very big leap into nationalism and it's arguably a testament to the durability and strength of democratic and egalitarian cultural norms that the series has evolved the way it has instead of becoming something more actively right-wing.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 9 months ago (1 children)

Isn't Hearts of Iron IV the game of choice for people who want to explore victorious virtual Third Reichs?

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[–] [email protected] 0 points 9 months ago (1 children)

Does anyone know if the L5 Society ever got weird and racist back in the day?

[–] [email protected] 0 points 9 months ago (1 children)

looks like not that i could find smoking guns of, but i was surprised to see the Heritage Foundation pop up as a supported (specifically to advocate the "High Frontier", I would presume in the interest of defense spending)

[–] [email protected] 0 points 9 months ago (1 children)

I think Jerry Pournelle was involved in that.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 9 months ago (1 children)

sure was! Him and the other ardent SF-Industrial-Complex guys

[–] [email protected] 0 points 9 months ago (1 children)

I must cop to reading Pournelle's Chaos Manor column voluntarily. I was very young.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 9 months ago

@gerikson

Same. Even though every one seemed to involve getting help with some problem “Big Cat” was having.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 9 months ago

"New research shows training LLMs on exponentially more data will yield only linear gains. So as Silicon Valley seeks ever more data, compute, energy and human works for AI systems, the improvements will be marginal at best. Something tells me this new info isn't going to stop it."

https://twitter.com/bcmerchant/status/1777374294915559907

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