Also, nobody wants to hire anymore.
If employers get to say it when they can't fill poverty wage positions, the rest of us get to say it when employers fail to offer 7 figure salaries.
this post was submitted on 21 Jan 2024
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Work Reform
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A place to discuss positive changes that can make work more equitable, and to vent about current practices. We are NOT against work; we just want the fruits of our labor to be recognized better.
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- All workers must be paid a living wage for their labor.
- Income inequality is the main cause of lower living standards.
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- Higher wages for underpaid workers.
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I mean I'm GenX, and I've been fired from three different jobs for reasons beyond my control.
The concept of working for one company for your whole career, getting promoted to a high paying position, retiring with a healthy pension simply no longer exists anymore. You can work hard and do everything right, even be in a division that's making money and you still might lose your job simply because laying off employees looks good to the shareholders.
But it's all the fault of the young people! You just need to work harder... on your LinkedIn profile because what you do for the company you're at right now doesn't matter, it's what it looks like you do that matters more now.
My grandfather was a soldier so my dad could be a farmer so I could be a poet.
My grandfather was a garbage man so my father could be a fireman so I could stock grocery shelves whilst writing the Great American Novel on my days off.
The only reason i work 80 hours a week is so that my employees and my future children don't have to have the same luck as me.
If i had a regular life i would not ever work 40 hours.
I see how little my dad gets as a pension and how much my grandpa got. I will not receive anything.
I want to put the effort I give earning money to be put towards bettering my life. All my lemons are being juiced for someone else's lemonade.
America isn’t a country, it’s just a business. That business minded model for society has drained all decency out of it. The US is a kleptocratic, psychopathic, oligarchy that has rotted out the brains of formerly decent people who have become the monsters we all see in stories like these. It will take multiple generations to fix this, if that is even possible.
Your ~~brainwashed~~ mesmerized grandparents and their lazy non-voting baby boomer children let Reagan through the door in no uncertain terms, and in that environment the 80s "hostile corporate takeover" and junk bonds fever set in; with bottomless greed as the virus, which like herpes, seems to stick around forever.
EDIT: a word
America isn’t a country, it’s just a business
It's three businesses in a country sized trench coat.
It reeks of those headlines saying that millenials/gen zs are "losing interest in buying cars and houses".
Motherfucker, interest has nothing to do with it. We can't afford it!
Well interest does come into it. Y'all can't afford the interest payments on the loans you'd need. Can't even find a decently priced used car.
Oooh, cool word play! I like it.
Also, I find it funny* that we somehow can afford rent but are not qualified to pay a mortgage with monthly payments that costs the same.
*enraging
We can afford rent?
X'er here. Been doing this my entire life. Fuck the corporate overlords. Everyone should prioritize life over work. Unfortunately for most the world is against them in this regard.
Also genX, I went hard in corporate life for a long time, survived many rounds of layoffs and watched good friends go for reasons that are bad ones- until one fine day I was laid off with 18,000 others. Meanwhile they kept hiring H1B workers and doing stock buybacks and doing mass-layoffs every 2 years to keep the regional labor market full of competition and wages depressed. Knowing that they're not interested in keeping their promises of stability and prosperity goes a long ways towards me never going above and beyond
For you what does prioritizing life over work look like exactly? Genuinely curious.
It means only working as hard as you're paid to. If the multi-billion dollar megacorp you're working for is only paying you $18/hr, you only put in an $18/hr effort; i.e. Work just barely hard enough to not get fired.
Yeah, this is generally an ok attitude.
The only exception I think is worth thinking about is "Don't minimum-ass it in a way that makes it suck for your peers." Like, don't work nights and weekends to hit unrealistic goals, agreed. But like I won't push up half-assed untested code that you're going to have to maintain. I'm having trouble coming up with good examples off the top of my head.
That's a great point and actually a perfect example of how I really feel when I say "work hard enough to not get fired". Should also add, "so long as it's not at the expense of your coworkers" to that saying.
You get what you pay for, pay your employees shit and get shit. Completely remove all rewards for hard work and no ones going to be incentivized to do more than the bare minnimum.
"Many of us built, whether it's bought homes or whatever, based on this promise of stability," Jesuthasan said. "There was this expectation that the tail was bigger. And we took on liabilities and obligations early on because of that tail. I think this generation has seen that tail dissipate."
In other words, when millennials did what their parents did and assumed if they worked hard they'd get to live a decent life. Then they got fucked by companies whose priorities became getting as much out of their employees as possible while investing in those employees as little as possible.
As a millennial, I hated the idea of debt. As a result, I've had no debt beyond college loans despite being able to afford a lower middle class lifestyle. It took me never living alone (roommates, SOs) but I did it. The education was bullshit and the loans were obscene but I got a piece of paper that helped me keep my job. After working in the public sector for 20+ years I actually had my loans forgiven... and now rent is going through the roof to compensate. Still, I might actually own a home before I'm 50, assuming current and future landlords don't decide to take me for all I'm worth.
When I finally own a home, I'm sure it'll get washed away by the thirteenth "century flood" that year or some other bullshit thanks to climate change. So fucking glad I decided not to have kids. Fuck this world.
Promise of what? I think the major change with millennials and gen z is that we see through the dogmatism that is corporate culture. Even if the promise was that of the "American dream" 50 years ago it's quite clearly not worth it to sacrifice your youth and 1/3 of your life (another third being sleep) to afford to sit around in a house and squeeze in stagnant social obligations for the rest of your life.
Life is what you make of it, and familial loyalty to a company that doesn't care about me just doesn't cut it.
I’m curious about how different Gen Z is from Millennials here, because everyone in my age range that I know seems to share this sentiment with them?
Gen x here and we seen it coming as well but no options for us at the time. I don’t blame any of you. Corporate greed and the great 401k lie is bullshit. They want us to work till we’re dead. Screw them.
The great 401k lie?
Can't speak for OP, but I don't look at the 401k as a stable retirement vehicle. It's a vehicle to pump "dumb money" (read: casino chips) into the stock market. If the stock market downturns just before you retire, if the firm managing your 401k makes bad investments, if another 2008-style real estate collapse happens, your retirement fund suddenly has less money in it than you hoped, so you're gonna have to work longer.
if the firm managing your 401k makes a bad investment
The administrator of your accounts has zero control over most of the funds available in them, their rise or fall, and your funds are separate from any investments that financial institution may or may not have made.
If you have a 401k with fidelity, or ADP or Schwab or Trowe Price or whoever, some of those are banks, soke finance companies, some payroll, anyway, the point is for each, the money in your account is yours to allot and invest as you wish based on yhe invesrment options your company chose or negotiating with them to administer your company's plan. The admin makes money by admin fees, not by taking your money and reinvesting it in something you don't know about. Granted, yes if there is a stock market crash, most financial companies will similarly overall struggle, but they have lots of arms and operations (mortgage loans, commercial, consumer banking, investment banking, etc.) and they are 100% all disconnected from the money in your 401k.
That said, 401ks are awful and a sham that were pushed on an uninformed public and we've only just begun to see the effects as the first generation reaches end of work age...and can't stop working. It'll continue. Props to anyone fighting and organizing against it or trying to avoid as much as possible. System fully bought and broken by greed.
What's the point of your first two paragraphs? The person you responded to is 100% right. The point is to pump money in to the fuckin stock market so the wealthiest people can profit off that "investment"
The point was is the plan administrator has no control over whether the value of his account goes up and down, which Op said they did. I agree with everything else Op said but think it's important since most people don't understand the mechanics to learn about them so added the correct info.
When the plan administrator is picking the stocks in their “Target Retirement 2055” account, I’d say they have a large amount of control.
Now the S&P 500? Probably no control. But is it truly the S&P 500 or some bull shirt index fund from the 401k provider that’s not 100% following the S&P 500?
The portion of the comment I replied to, which I highlighted at the top of my response was that Op had said that "if the company managing your 4401k makes a bad investment", concerned that (among Ops other accurate concerns) your 401k funds could be used elsewhere without your knowledge or permission by the plan administrator, which they can't. So I corrected it.
Lazy people immediately REEE when someone doesn't immediately jump on the tribal circle jerk and agree even when parts of a statement are incorrect. Ops point was overall correct and a good one and correcting something that was wrong doesn't mean I disagree with the rest of it. Lookup false dichotomy.
If you’re investment is in the hands of a company that’s manually picking and choosing you’re in bad hands.
Better?
I feel like millennials have a "It is what it is, guess ill work til I die" attitude whereas Gen Z have more of a Bartleby the Scrivener "I'd rather not" energy.
I just saw Docs, nurses and staff who had pensions for 30+ years just get butchered as the new Hospital system took over. Routed it all to standard 401ks. Why put your soul into a company. They will never come through. That ship has sailed.
My only hope is people look around at the fact that one of the few ways to still get a pension is through union work, and the current unionization wave continues into something bigger, better, and greater than we've had in the past.