News/Interesting Stories/Beautiful Pictures from Europe 🇪🇺
(Current banner: Thunder mountain, Germany, 🇩🇪 ) Feel free to post submissions for banner pictures
(This list is obviously incomplete, but it will get expanded when necessary)
Also check out [email protected]
I think it's more that we realize that sometimes getting invaded and having an outside power depose your tyrannous government is the best thing that can happen to you. Even if the process is brutal.
could be that, or could be that you guys never realized that human rights are for all humans.. but keep repeating "never again" - that'll solve everything..
They are. But Israel is hardly committing any violations here. Responsible for the suffering in Gaza right now is Hamas. They started a war and gave Israel no choice but to defend itself. Hamas could end this war within hours by simply surrendering and the Palestinian people are lucky that they're being invaded by the IDF and not the Red Army and that Isreal isn't ready force a surrender by using firebombings and nuclear weapons like America did in WW2.
“As the example of the Israel-Palestine conflict shows,” writes Pappe, “historical disinformation, even of the most recent past, can do tremendous harm. This willful misunderstanding of history can promote oppression and protect a regime of colonization and occupation. It is not surprising, therefore, that policies of disinformation continue to the present and play an important part in perpetuating the conflict…The Zionist historical account of how the disputed land became the state of Israel is based on a cluster of myths that subtly cast doubt on the Palestinians’ moral right to the land…This book challenges these myths, which appear in the public domain as indisputable truths. These statements are, to my eyes, distortions and fabrications that can—and must—be refuted through a closer examination of the historical record.”
"The problem is that people of Palestinian or Arab descent feel that they cannot express their concerns and criticisms."
No, the problem is that many seem to be completely unable to get rid of the people supporting their criticism while openly calling for the killing of all jews.
There were peaceful protests in Germany. Nobody had a problem with those. But the majority was instead infested with radicals that should have no place in a civilized society.
There is also a lot of criticism of Israel's government. And funnily enough we can read all these statements in international as well as German media... while they are being actively censored. Sure.
If I publically talk about a topic and half the audience cheering are nazis I will stop, reevaluate my message and clearly distance myself from them. When you 'protest peacefully' to critisize Israel's government however it's okay when a big share of attendees carry symbols of terrorist organisations. And if those protests are then banned it's "censoring of Palestinian human rights".
Don't get me wrong here... I am the first one telling you that the current government in Israel is a big part of the problem (for the very same reason: not distancing themselves from the radical morons - no, it isn't enough to speak out against statements of some government official later, those people can't have a place there at all).
And the official German government statements were clearly lacking balance. But they were widely and loudly criticised publically for it by many. And many called their initial reaction a massive overreaction. (Again... that was public and not censored...)
Yet many of those who camplain about banned protests and censoring however have actually another problem entirely: That they often can't (or don't want to) distance themselves from that strange other half of "Israel criticsm" that is in fact criticising their right to exist.
Fix your own side of the bed first, then you can start complaining.
There were peaceful protests in Germany. Nobody had a problem with those.
Nobody? Really? You don't think the right-wing Springer press (just to name the most glaring example) that is ideologically allied with ultranationalists in Israel had a problem with those? That they wouldn't have cried foul even if the protests where utterly devoid of any radicals? That they wouldn't have tried to censor even your imagined peaceful protests?
your imagined peaceful protests
Yeah, sure. Protests with 10 thousand people in which maybe a few dozen were stopped by the police and a handful of banners were confiscated as questionable were totally not peaceful and unproblematic. And they are also not well documented in the media but imaginary.
If you refuse reality, that's a really bad basis for trying to argue.
Fix your own side of the bed first, then you can start complaining.
Thats the problem with both sides, though, isn't it? Its always the other sides fault. And "our" side shouldn't need to fix anything until "your" side fixes their problem.
Its an easy way to sit on your ass and do nothing, because clearly the "other side" is worse.
Thats the problem with both sides, though, isn't it? Its always the other sides fault.
One side, the German government, was loudly criticised for their one-sided support comments. And later for their harsh reaction of banning protests when those protests included terrorists and anti-semites.
They are trying to fix the former, by also speaking up about the Israeli side of illegal settlements on one hand and Israel's responsibility to think about collateral civilian damages. Is this perfect? Of course not, but they are doing something. There is no need to "fix" the latter as we don't need people advocating for Israel's destruction (or Germany's destruction to create a new caliphate here - yes, that also happened in some of these protests) on our streets.
And then on other side we have people who still try to sell the banning of anti-semitism in protests as censoring Arab and Palestinian voices. And who have often done shit fixing anything.
Sorry, if you don't understand the concept of freedom of expression and opinion in comparison to absolute free speech. But that's how it is in Germany. Your freedom to say something publically definitely ends long before public calls for violence. We won't and we don't want to change that.
The sane ones advocating for Palestina without calling for the destruction of Israel themselves or associating with people that do... I can read about their opinions daily in the media. I guess they are doing a very bad job at censoring these voices. Or they never actually tried and it's not people being censored but certain opinions for specific reason that questions their status of "legitimate opinion".
I'm really not seeing any protesters with "from the river to the sea Israel will be free" posters in Germany, quite the opposite I've heard Jewish voices expressing support for humanitarian aid to Palestine and criticism of Israel's government and the violence committed by settlers. On the other hand a liberal mosque is closing because of the threat of attacks and police have to be posted in front of synagogues around the clock. Who is being silenced here and who is sitting on their asses?
I’m really not seeing any protesters with “from the river to the sea Israel will be free” posters in Germany
~~Correct, not anymore since they banned that slogan from protests. That's the censoring we are talking about.~~
