this post was submitted on 12 Mar 2025
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I'm answering on faith that you are arguing a sincerely held belief.
It is exactly because Europe remembers what happens when you have an unchecked aggressive neighbour who is better armed than you that rearing is necessary. You seem to be victim blaming. "The more armed Europe is the more Europeans get killed." Sounds like "we wouldn't have to kill you if you'd just stop fighting for your survival." Against enemies like nazi Germany or nazi Russia you don't just let them take what they want because they will just keep taking until you have nothing left.
Now the threat IS Russia. It is the fact that you ask why I am bringing them into it that makes me think you either are Russian, are pro Russian, or are trolling me. Why do I bring them in to it? They invaded a country on the edge of the European Union and have shown no honour on the battlefield, committing war crimes. They have a desire to bring back the USSR and many of those countries are now members of the European Union. They have shown willingness to take what they want, and they want to bring back the USSR.
So more guns means more dead Europeans? Really. Sounds like an argument from Russia to encourage disarming their enemies, because more funds in Europe more likely means a stand off, or fewer dead Europeans and more dead Russians.
P.S. I didn't say what the alternative is because it is bloody obvious. Obvious to me, to Ukraine, to the USA, to the world leaders, and to Russia, but not you.
How did you come to this conclusion? I don't see how anyone could realistically believe that.
Your whole point is "we need to take up arms because of the alternative"... but you're not saying what it is so nobody can possibly be convinced by your prematurely aborted line-of-reasoning.
von de Leyen raised the figure of €850 billion. The money could house 6,500,000 families.
Do you believe that the arms will be used to A) defend the homelands, or B) do things like this and this?
How did I come to that conclusion... "The demise of the Soviet Union was the greatest geopolitical catastrophe of the century." Vladimir Putin
And this And this And this etc. etc. etc. Needless to say I am far from the lone conspiracy theorist your are trying to paint me as.
No I think they will be used to defend against things like this
Edit: Oh and since you seem to be deliberately avoiding acknowledging it. The alternative is a deeper Russian invasion of Europe.
That's reasonable. Most people believe that.
Oh come on, they failed in three years of trying to invade even half of a country with a smaller GDP than Greece. I'm not gonna be persuaded to support sending nearly a trillion euro to right-wing militaries by that. We both know they'll use it to project power to the Middle East and Africa.
I might read your links after the Madrid derby finishes up.
Most people in Eastern Europe think about the Soviet occupation as one of the greatest tragedies of modern history. I don't know which world you live in where they weren't an oppressive power.
They came raping and pillaging, they took people away in trains never to be seen again, and they ravaged our countries in more ways than one.
And to be honest, Russia is currently doing more than its share of power projection and destabilization in Africa and the Middle East.
https://www.pewresearch.org/global/2019/10/15/european-public-opinion-three-decades-after-the-fall-of-communism/
That is great, you can try to run as a communist in any of those countries, see where that gets you. It's allowed, Hungary even has a communist party on the ballot.
That's not what we were talking about?