417
Trump's plan to end the Ukraine war is to totally cut off funding, says Putin's closest EU ally
(www.businessinsider.com)
this post was submitted on 12 Mar 2024
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To be more clear, if Trump manages to capture the presidency, I fully expect him to withdraw the US from NATO.
And the US leaving NATO would be absolutely, categorically, inarguably, and apocalyptically stupid.
The money that runs this country wouldn’t stand for the level of disruption that’d cause to the ongoing grift to slow/stop. Same why we likely won't ever crash out on the deficit, the rating downgrade scared them so bad the Republicans made a deal ASAP last time
What’s terrifying is if the money decides to go in and join in the ‘creative destruction’ via another Business Plot and co-opts authoritarianism
Can Trump alone withdrawal us from NATO?
Nope, but he can fuck NATO over internally well enough.
No, which is why it didn’t happen in his first term. Lots of people threw sand in the gears to slow that effort down.
It’s just that if he gets in again, he’s openly said he’s going to fire a shitload of people all over the government and replace them with Trump loyalists (regardless of whether or not it’s legal), so it will probably actually happen if he captures the presidency again.
Relaxing people for family members and other loyalist is fair game in an autocracy.
I am not sure why people say that when Trump said, if they didn't honor their commitments, we would leave.
Since the invasion, most countries have finally stepped up to pair their obligation. Funny how Trump was right.
No he wasn't. His comments are a self fulfilling prophecy. If an alliance that is strong because they are united under the US umbrella has the potential leader of said alliance state he no longer feels he needs to back his allies.. they must.
But:
Ah the "Fine, I'll takey ball and go home" arguement.
Referring to WW2 that was self preservation as much as anything else, and it is not like they got poorer from it. The US made bank after WW2.
The US called upon NATO after September 9th and everyone came. So that also shows something, but I guess that does not count.
And now the US is gearing up for their "inevitable" conflict with China. But for that they will need their allies too. So by showing your allies you are unreliable, countries might start making other choices. You know, self preservation.
Ww2 was because Japan attacked the United States and in brilliant move, Germany declared war.
If we go to war with China, we don’t need the help of others. They need our help.
It’s why Australia is asking for us to build bases. They know they can’t take China.
Japan at least is taking it seriously and arming up for war. They beat China once
Yeah people dying is just like poke mon cards. Not wanting to eee kids to die is just like poke mon cards.
I have never seen a comment devalue human life in such trivial way.well done
Whoosh
American exceptionalism at its finest.
We are exceptional. We are the only real super power in the world. I am not ashamed of my country. We need to the beacon of the world and sadly we’ve let that falter. We need another Reagan to get us back on track
You posting this from a desk at Savushkina Street in St. Petersburg?
... a school desk.
What do you think is false? If you think anything I said is false then we don’t need to be in your war.
Good job entirely (and, I think, intentionally) misinterpreting the whole fuckin’ context of the situation.
Check out what community they moderate, it's very telling.
I just miss the era when the vast majority of Americans were on the same page regarding potentially dangerous geopolitical crap. Politics used to end at the water’s edge for the most part, but not anymore.
Everyone now just chooses a "side" and blindly defends it, no matter how wrong it is. There is zero room for nuance. It's exhausting to talk to people like Wintermute who will ignore all evidence that is contrary to their opinions and will resort to bad faith arguments every single time. And then blindly accuse othet people of doing the same when called out.
Politics have gone to hell and we're all worse off for it.
Don't you fucking "both sides" this shit. The GOP has gone to hell, Democrats are scrabbling for a handhold so we don't all get dragged down with em.
I'm not blaming both sides here. I'm pointing out Wintermute's behaviour, which is blindly defending their side despite all evidence that they're wrong. I'm very, VERY well aware of how fucked the Republicans are and I'm not pretending the Democrats are remotely the same. My point is, an entire portion of the populace (that being the right wing) has shut themselves off to reality and nothing will change their mind.
My point is name and shame the Republicans, don't use a euphemism line "an entire portion of the populace" because that enables the both sides bullshit
Fair enough. I'll remember that.
Thank you. Sorry if I was too combative. I do that sometimes.
No worries! If you were talking to an actual "Both sides" idiot then I'd say it's warranted lol.
Be more clear in your point. I get you don't like Trump but what he said was true.
Now everyone is scurrying because he was right.
Hate the man as much as you want but at the end of the day, he was right.
You fight a war with the Army you have, not the one you can build in the next five years. Europe has not taken their defense seriously, and it isn't our job to spend our money to defend Europe. It is our job to help in their defense.
Putin was a wakeup call to Europe and hopefully they leaned you always need to be prepared for war.
Ok, sure, let’s play your game.
Let’s say Trump gets in, and the US fucks off from NATO. What then?
Outline the ramifications for me. I have a pretty concrete idea of what the fallout would be, but I want you to tell me what you think would happen, in your own words.
Easy Trump says we are leaving NATO then he finds out he can't. So the united states stays in NATO. https://www.washingtonpost.com/national-security/2023/12/16/congress-nato-exit-trump/
I get Trump is the baba yaga to most people but congress was smart enough to cover their bases.
You didn’t answer the question I posed.
You unilaterally disregarded one of the two core points I specified in the antecedent, and then pretended it was the same question. It’s not. You fundamentally altered the question by doing that.
I did. I even cited it. Trump can't do what you are describing. It would be overruled.
Bad faith argument. Gotcha.
I’m not playing this game with you. Welcome to my block list.
It was his intention to do this last time.
He never intended to lose (or to be removed after rejecting a loss), so there was no rush