You were wrong about the state of the conflict prior to October 7th. You refuse to admit it and now you want to sidestep your own ignorance through semantics and pedantry. Have fun with that.
cecinestpasunbot
joined 1 year ago
What a pedantic and useless argument. Palestinians want a sovereign state. The international community recognizes that they have a right to one. However, Israel violates that right every day therefore deny Palestinians a truly sovereign state.
Honestly, stop pretending you know anything about the plight of the Palestinian people. You showed your ignorance by claiming there was not violent conflict immediately prior to October 7th.
This is something new but I’m still pretty skeptical and I think rightly so. Photos and videos posted to telegram aren’t always what people claim they are. I also haven’t seen any new media willing to say whether or not these videos show what they purport to show. I’d add that it’s also entirely possible for North Korean troops to enter Russia as part of some joint training exercises. However, they may not be intended for deployment in Ukraine.
I’d also be interested to know why the US or NATO do not seem to want to validate any of these claims at this time.
What an absurd comparison. Palestinians in Gaza were under an ongoing military siege by Israel. That looks absolutely nothing like a border between two independent sovereign states. It’s laughable that you would think otherwise.
Edit: Just so you understand how utterly wrong you are, here’s an article about Israel bombing Gaza just weeks before October 7th.
Articles like this one are just a search away. Maybe take five seconds and do that before making wildly inaccurate claims next time.
When do you think this conflict started? Because if you’re not aware Israel has been bombing Gaza for decades. The bombing of the desalinization plant I mentioned happened in 2021 and Israel has bombed water infrastructure in Gaza far before that.
Don’t avoid the question this time. In such circumstances what do you expect Palestinians to do? Because as far as I can tell the only answer you have for them is death.
You said,
It wasn’t an armed conflict until they began it on October 7th.
I disagreed with that assessment. What’s so hard for you to understand?
Of course there was armed conflict or do you think the apartheid and blockade of Gaza was enforced with bubblegum and rainbows?
What do expect Palestinians to do? Do you want them to waste away drinking contaminated water because Israel attacked their sole desalination plant? That isn’t peace either.
I generally agree but with a few caveats.
First, this is a uniquely bad headline. More reputable outlets would report it as something like “Russia denies using North Korean troops in war effort, Ukrainian Intelligence claims otherwise”. That at least allows the reader to understand who is making what claim and whether or not that claim is contested.
Second, most people are not anywhere as skeptical of media outlets as they should be. They may expect bias but rarely do people in western countries expect journalists to regurgitate and launder whatever wild claims state officials make. Unfortunately thats exactly what many new agencies do which is why I think it’s important to talk about when discussing articles like this one.
They aren't being obtuse. They’re just an idealist. They likely believe the decisions people make and the things they choose to believe in are detached from the circumstances in which people find themselves. In their mind, morality is self evident and anyone committing an immoral act, as they define it, could simply choose not to.
As far as I can tell these claims are largely coming from Ukrainian sources. I have not seen independent validation from anywhere else. At best we can say is that Ukrainian intelligence claims North Koreans troops are being deployed as part of Russia’s invasion.
Unfortunately, the headline of this article acts as if this is a known fact. A better headline would be include the source of the accusation being made. That’s a problem because most in this thread and the other similar threads are treating the claims made as fact and any reasonable skepticism is downvoted and dismissed.
If you're unwilling to admit that you were wrong about the state of the conflict prior to October 7th then it's pretty reasonable for me to assume you're arguing in bad faith.
If you really want me to explain to you the difference between between the right to sovereignty and the material existence of a sovereign state I can. I could even provide you with articles written by Palestinians on the topic. However, why should I do that when it just seems like you want to pretend you've won some internet argument for the sake of your own ego.