this post was submitted on 11 May 2024
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submitted 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago) by [email protected] to c/[email protected]
 

Why do we focus solely on this one aspect of life?

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[–] [email protected] 5 points 4 months ago (1 children)

Kinda like when an AI is overtrained on one thing that wasn't really correlated to its original goal, we've attempted to create a system that organizes collaboration between people; were now so overtrained on acquiring wealth that some would rather the planet burn than risk acquiring slightly less.

Its similar enough to a trail of ants in a death spiral; the same essential survival instincts that their society depends on, now nefariously dooming all involved to a slow starvation.

That being said similarly to the ants most of the populace will do the average (as it's what's kept us alive this long so how could it harm us?) And continue the spiral, but if one individual is able to reconnect the spiral to the main pheramone train the entire death spiral may be avoided

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[–] [email protected] 15 points 4 months ago (1 children)

Modern society is only possible because of global trade networks. Global trade networks would never work without currency. If a person spends all their day fabricating metal sheets they need a way to buy bread to feed their family. Otherwise we'd all be back to farming our lives away.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 4 months ago (3 children)
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[–] [email protected] 1 points 4 months ago

Yuval Noah Harari, Sapiens. Enjoy.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 4 months ago (1 children)

Barter was never a thing in daily life. No anthropogist found evidence for that. Trust based systems were used, but those don't work well when they population increases and interaction with strangers happens more. That's where currency takes over.

Why currency is the most important thing right now? Because currency at the moment is status and many people seek a high status on society.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 4 months ago (1 children)

It's not because we require currency in order to meet our basic needs?

[–] [email protected] 1 points 4 months ago

Today, yes. We're dealing with a few billion people with stuff shipped across the planet now.

[–] [email protected] 20 points 4 months ago (1 children)

Because they represent a resource, concrete or abstract. Currency is easily exchanged, either for other currencies, or for goods and services. This allows for a lot more opportunities than hauling around a swarm of sheep for bartering at the car dealership.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 4 months ago (2 children)

On one end carrying sheep would be annoying, but so is a credit score; arguably both are sources of noise distracting humanity from actually improving at all

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[–] [email protected] 6 points 4 months ago

Every exchange between people requires an exchange of value. If we both agree on a common "thing" as a representation of value, we can be more accurate and flexible in our transactions.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 4 months ago

The first question has been answered already a few different ways. As to the sub-question:

Why do we focus solely on this one aspect of life?

It’s because we as a society lost track of other aspects of life, e.g. relationships for the sake of relationships- which if we question our basic humanity, we also need. Instead we focus on materialistic requirements, both for basic survival but also for status, security, and comfort. I would argue that second aspect (status) is an indirect (and inefficient/ineffective) means to accomplish the forgotten parts of life (relationships).

[–] [email protected] 11 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago)

You can either barter or you can have currency. Currency is the means through which the economy functions. You need something abstract to indicate value. That's currency.

In a post-scarcity society, when everyone could just get everything they wanted whenever on a whim just because, we could get rid of it. Could. Probably wouldn't. That society is a fantasy. But it's nice to dream of.

[–] [email protected] 30 points 4 months ago

Because it's very difficult to get things you need to live solely through barter. Many trades are very niche, and an economy that uses money allows those trades to continue being viable parts of society.

Like, think of plumbing. If everything goes well, you don't need a plumber. But when you do...you really need it. Now imagine being the plumber who wants some bread and eggs but the farmer has no problems currently that needs the plumber's skills. Plumber can't eat, leaves profession, there's now no plumber when the pipes do break.

Obviously, the next thought here might be, "Well, why doesn't the plumber say if they get eggs and bread now, they'll come and fix your toilet later if needed?" But that sort of re-invents credit, right? "I'll trade 3 future plumbing problems for 3 boxes of eggs now." If you have that, why not money?

So basically, money is very useful. It can be traded for many things you otherwise wouldn't be able to get if you were only able to offer as barter a specific item that might be rejected by the other person you want to barter with. Money is a "universal" trade good, and it's also easy to store (you don't have to have lots of physical room to store your Universal Trade Good).

The BEHAVIOR of people surrounding this very useful thing can absolutely be suspect, depending on the person (greedy sociopaths hoarding wealth)--but that's a human thing, not because money is innately a bad thing. It's a social problem, not a technology problem. You could totally have a greedy hoarder storing up a non-money trade item too...see people and toilet paper/sanitizer during Covid.

[–] [email protected] 10 points 4 months ago (1 children)

It lubricates economic activity (not a lewd joke). It makes it easier to exchange shit, which leads to a more robust economy. Would you rather barter?

[–] [email protected] 2 points 4 months ago

Sometimes I would rather barter because the additional effort would make things more important instead of all the mass produced crap that is ruining the world. A robust wconomy tends to mean an excess of stuff we don't need.

But it wouldn't reeally work out that way, just wishful thinking.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 4 months ago (1 children)

Because that philosophy has won over the most people.

I didn’t say it was the best. You may or may not believe that living in a yurt foraging mushrooms might be the best life; but “western “ civilization has deemed capitalism to be the way.

Under capitalism people need money to use for the things they want that they cannot make themselves.

A wise man once said “Money can’t buy me Love” —but it certainly improves your bargaining position

[–] [email protected] 15 points 4 months ago (1 children)

I should note that currency and capitalism are not the same thing. Pretty much every existing economic system has currency of some form, it's just a way of tracking the relative values of various things so that people can make agreements about who gets what.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 4 months ago

This is a very important distinction. Even socialism and communism can use currency to track value.

[–] [email protected] 81 points 4 months ago (2 children)

Simpsons meme aside --

Those with currency can have significantly more options than those without it. I'm of a privileged state where if I wanted to drop everything and visit another country for two weeks, there's nothing stopping me financially. Not many people have that luxury.

[–] [email protected] 23 points 4 months ago (7 children)

Your comment made me realize that OP wasn't asking about why we need currency as a society, but why people keep trying to get more money.

I hate when the post title and post content ask two seemingly different questions, lol

[–] [email protected] 2 points 4 months ago (6 children)

It's a hard question to ask. I'd rather pin down why it's essential then ask why it's deemed the only thing that is essential.

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[–] [email protected] 9 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago)

Food, water, sex, security, shelter. This are the major factors that drove human behavior. Currency is only useful in that it can be used to secure the other things.

Nobody is lusting after a hyperinflated Zimbabwe dollar.

[–] [email protected] 21 points 4 months ago (5 children)

Consider what we used as currency before it was currency. You would have to barter before, which was inefficient. Common currency saves you and everyone involved time. Instead of having to barter for every item, which would also require you to do carry all of those items, you can just pay with currency now.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 4 months ago

A lot of cultures ended up with effective currencies. Whether that was grains of rice or chickens there ended up a small number of items that had a well understood value and ended up being the default item of trade, not because the receiver needed those items but because they were known to be easily exchanged with others.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 4 months ago

That's not exactly true. Barter was never used like that in the past. People used gift giving systems or other trust based systems in daily life. Barter was only used with strangers and that was not a common occurrence. These trust based systems do work in smaller settings but break down in large settings where interacting with strangers is the norm.

[–] [email protected] 9 points 4 months ago (1 children)

We can think of it as a universal language for trading. It doesn’t matter what item you eventually want, you can trade money to get it.

[–] [email protected] -4 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago) (2 children)

Extrapolating, want, or greed, is what gives money its value?

[–] [email protected] 9 points 4 months ago

The ability to purchase items you want with money gives it value.

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[–] [email protected] 10 points 4 months ago (1 children)

I'll trade you 6 lima beans for a salt packet.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 4 months ago

No, I need this salt for lima beans.

[–] [email protected] 5 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago)

Time, agree, time is what is most essential to everyone here on this planet.

[–] [email protected] 47 points 4 months ago (1 children)

Makes it easier to buy food and pay for rent.

My landlord doesn't want to barter for goods and services on a monthly basis.

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