this post was submitted on 12 Jun 2024
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It seems ableist to assume someone's mental health is what causes homophobia
My grandpa had dementia when he died and thought I was his brother, and I also never heard him say queerphobic words
This is just bad science. Did your dad and grandad also speak multiple languages and belong to an organization that has splintered into factions, some of which whose purpose is to try to destroy all good will and faith built with marginalized communities?
My mom at least speaks multiple languages and for over 20 years of knowing English she thought that maggot was the slur and the word with the hard f sound that rhymes with maggot was the acceptable one to say. It wasn’t until I corrected her behavior did she actually know it was wrong. She will still drop the f-word because the word association has been long since made but at least she apologizes and corrects herself now.
See now we have conflicting anecdotes and the glaring question gets ignored.
Cui bono?
Nice job trying to excuse and downplay homophobia. I'm old as fuck, and we've known for a very long time these words were harmful. If your family just accepted the norm at the time and upheld a status quo that harmed and erased queer people, and then never changed to the point that they would just stop, then fuck them. They're bigots, and they're not good people.
And yes, I have family who speak English, Spanish, Korean, Swedish, and Norwegian, and only the completely dogshit ones who I'd never claim or associate with are bigots.
Fuck the pope, and fuck everyone who's making excuses for him being a bigot.
Only been about 20 years since the push against using slurs. It’s shocking now to watch movies from 2010 and earlier because it’s so prevalent. How far we’ve come as far as respecting other people really obscures how long it really has been.
Really was an honest mistake, I didn’t find out she had mixed up the slur and word for larva of order Diptera until I audited her teaching class. The other educator with me didn’t even react and told me she had been doing it for as long as she knew her. Not her students, not the parents or other teachers ever bothered to correct her. She loved teaching about the life cycle of flies but her fear of accidentally slipping a slur killed that passion.
I’m not apologizing for the pope nor bigots at large. Just saying that there are circumstances in which someone who appears to be one thing isn’t, and you should be suspicious of being told what someone else looks like if you can’t see for yourself.
I hope the Pope gets killed instantly and horrifically. I need some uplifting news.
Why stop just at him? If death and destruction is how you get your kicks then why not hope for the elimination of an entire people too? If you get rid of all the Catholics and religious people do you think you will get rid of all the hate? What about all the people who don’t need to hate in the name of god, like you?
No the churches can all burn though with all the queerphobes and church leaders inside, ridding the world of a violent hate group forever <3
If it was that simple it would have been done already. In fact it’s been done multiple times, burning people doesn’t burn away the problem. Hate doesn’t need god, it simply exists as part of humanity. But by all means keep shouting that the elimination of people is the solution to the problem, real popular in Zionism these days you fit right in with them.
The pope is not going to fuck you, no matter how much you defend him online.
Unless of course you're a little boy. Then he probably would.
Not wanting people to die is not a defense of who they are. It’s simply not wishing death on others.
So you condemn the Pope's repeated use of a homophobic slur?
Condemn the usage of slurs? Easy and always.
But as for actually judging people only based on what they say or what others said they said? That’s for republicunts and religious idiots.
In the same way that 3000 year old stories are not sufficient evidence for people to believe in god, so are a couple news articles about words behind closed doors not enough evidence to condemn a man.
How dare we judge someone based on [checks notes] the actual words. they say???
But let's focus on the actual things the church believes for a moment. Certainly that's better, right? Certainly they're... hmmm... well, yikes!
But still this is the "good pope" right? So certainly he wouldn't... oh fuck.
Well, turns out it's fair after all to judge him as bring a confirmed queerphobe and the catholic church as a hate group.
So with this further context I repeat: do you condemn the pope's repeated use of an actual homophobic slur? (Not that you should require this further context, since he has no excuse for using this term as someone outside the queer community.)
The church provides pastoral care for LGBT Catholics through a variety of official and unofficial channels that vary from diocese to diocese, and senior clergy and popes have recently begun to call for the church to do more. In many parts of the world, the Church is active politically on issues of LGBT rights. The relationship between the Catholic Church and the LGBT community has been a difficult one, especially during the height of the AIDS crisis, and World War II Nazi Germany.[8]
Dang if only you had read the full article.
You know it’s real easy to judge others for the sins of their fathers. How far into your family history would we need to dig to judge you for the rape or murders your forebears likely committed?
Now I know all about Catholic doctrine having been raised in the faith. And first hand I have experienced their brand of hate, it was both taught to me and turned against me when I came out the closet. For a long time after I was ousted from that community I let that hate fester my every waking thought. It wasn’t until those feelings actually killed me and I came back from the other side that I realized how stupid the whole thing was. Hating those who hated me only produced more hate in the world.
I let go of the pain I felt by no longer wanting others to feel how I did.
Judging people on their words and their beliefs is the same discrimination you say to hate. Doing it to people who do it to you doesn’t magically make you right and them wrong, it’s always wrong.
So I will repeat myself, I condemn the use of slurs.
Do you specifically condemn the Pope for his use of slurs?
Also, not appreciating you downplaying the fact that the Catholic church clearly believes LGBTQIA+ is a sin. This is not allyship by any stretch of the imagination.
Irrelevant. I'd condemn them. There's never been an excuse for such behavior.
I'm only judging the church and it's shitty pope based on their actual words and actions. They're still an active hate group in 2024.
I condemn the use of slurs. Ask me that question again, I defy you to make me give you the same answer to the same question.
Then you have a severely limited imagination and an equally dismal knowledge of history beyond the past century. Does the small things the church has tried to do to mend all the awful things they’ve done? Not even close, frankly I’m not satisfied they’ve even begun to redeem themselves for the inquisition and they likely may never in my lifetime. Likely not yours or in a thousand or in a million but they might one day. That small infinitesimal chance is the same as life forming on Earth. I’m hedging my bets on the house.
This is what is irrelevant to my point. It’s not about how you judge others it’s about how others would judge you. Based on your logic of judging others harshly for the action of those that came before, you would be judged severely. Worry not for many would burn with you, myself included.
No but there’s been an infinite number of rationalizations used for it. Until humanity collectively became better and continues to do so it was a fact of life. Not an excuse just acceptance of reality.
Are you though? Because you seem reactionary only to what is in front of you. Not on the totality of human history nor through any perspective beyond your own do you seem to be making your decisions.
Yes they are but I can’t say for sure that they will tomorrow. Even if tomorrow they still are, still doesn’t answer for the day after or the one after that and ad infinitum until reality ends and no more chances for redemption could be had.
This is where you and I simply will not agree. I believe that everyone is worthy of redemption. What actually earns redemption is far beyond my point and what an organization as long and old as these fuckers would have to do truly stretches the imagination but it’s not an impossibility. I cannot judge what redeems others because I cannot judge what redeems me. All I know is that trying to be better today than yesterday has to be worth something.
Is that what that wiki page you presented and I quoted for you says to you? Because to me it says that opinions are split and change couldn’t come soon enough but it’s coming as fast as it can. If that isn’t good enough for you then that is your own personal problem.