this post was submitted on 03 Jun 2024
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Palestine
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A community for everything related to Palestine and the occupation currently underway by the occupying force known as Israel.
Anti-Zionism is not anti-Semitism. Existence is resistance for Palestinians.
Please refer to Israel as Occupied Palestine, or occupied territories. The IDF is a fascist and ethnonationalist occupying force. Israelis are settlers. We understand however that the imperial narrative (which tries to legitimise Israel) is internalised in the imperial core and slip-ups are naturally expected.
We always take the sides of Palestine and Palestinians and are unapologetic about it. Israel is an occupying power whose "defence force"'s (note the contradiction) sole purpose for existing is to push Palestinians out so they can resettle their rightful land. If you have anything positive to say about Israel we do not care.
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I don't think it's durable. As long as people kicked out from their properties since 1948 cannot return and Israel keels stealing more and more land there will be no peace.
not since 1948, since much, much earlier. Even before Palestine was under British rule.
To be honest, even though I want Palestinians to her their stolen property back, due to the robbers (Israel) military might they will never get pre 1948 back.
They would be very lucky if they got pre 1967 borders. I read that Hamas and PA agreed on that.
Better ask Palestinians on social network with what they would agree
They will. The Zionist project is inherent unsustainable. However, I agree that for now it’s unrealistic not to settle for pre-1967 borders (decolonisation of Gaza and West Bank)
I read the book "The Jewish Paradox" from Nahum Goldman, the First president of the World Zionist Congress and also president of the World Jewish Congress.
He was one of the leaders who accepted the UN partition plan. He says that Israelis at the time wanted to kill him, because Israelis wanted all the land for them, no compromise.
But other leaders were convinced that they would never get a better offer, and also that having a State was a good platform to later take all of the land to them, for with a State you have some minimal stability and you can get an army and all other infra structure that they didn't have before.
If the Palestinians also took this into consideration they could, I guess, be far better now.
I recommend you to read this book because:
Goldman is against the culture created by Ben Gurion of being enemies of Arabs, so he shows many of Israelis misdoings, and also because
you can see some of the strategies they used to create their country.
The same strategy could be useful for Palestinians.
Goldman was the most dovish member of the Zionist movement, directly responsible for the idea of a partition plan during meetings in Paris in 1946 program, as opposed to the Biltmoore conference, in which scum like Ben-Gurion exalted the idea of taking over all of Palestine. He was the one who pleaded with the British authorities to accept his plan before they transferred the matter to the UN in mid-late 1947.
Even before the existence of Israel, there was already effectively an embryonic state, called the Jewish agency, with Ben-Gurion serving both as Minister of Defense and Prime Minister. Its military was called the Hagana, which oversaw many ethnic cleansing operations and countless surveillance and reconnaissance operations, known as the “village files”. Their main money source was the JNF (Jewish monetary fund), which they used to buy plots of land from absentee landlords and to fund their campaigns.
Pretty sure that with everything I’ve said before, it disproves this claim. They would NOT be better off and had every right to criticise and denounce a plan that came straight out of the zionists. They had been building settlements and kicking out the native population as early as the mid 1910s, when Palestine was still under Ottoman rule. They also tried to accept Britain's system of “parity” with the settlers (that in practice favoured the latter), only for the latter to reject it and pave way to the 1929 (and in a way 1936) riots.
Lastly I highly doubt a Palestinian state could ever exist properly alongside the Zionist entity, as the latter's existence is predicated on genocide, violence and ethnic cleansing, but I can see where you’re coming from. Hamas supports a 2 state solution (probably as a temporary goal), so that gives me enough of a reason to support it too.
I might check out your book and I also recommend Ilan Pappe's “the ethnic cleansing of Palestine”. Genuinely amazing
This documentary is really good:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bwy-Rf15UIs
1948: Creation & Catastrophe (Full documentary)**
I have read a little about the Baltimore conference
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biltmore_Conference
Weird how since 100+ years some Jews talk about the area as if it was desertic and no human being was there.
Do they think the people Living there before are cockroaches or sand?
That's enraging
Maybe they have this tradition since milleniaz because in the Torah they just said "God gave them the land". Maybe their ethnic cleansing attitude is with them since thousands of years, no matter who is there.
What a racist inheritance!
I was really going to ask you for a book indication. Nice that you did it on the end.
If I could I would follow you, but Lemmy doesn't has this option :(