this post was submitted on 01 Jun 2024
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The comment I was responding to wasn't talking about death rates.
Infrastructure, my friend, that's how we make bicycling less dangerous. Riding a bicycle itself isn't all that dangerous, even without a helmet. What is dangerous, is interacting with cars.
My dude, have you never ridden a bicycle in your life?
Of all of my bike crashes, only two involved a car. One spectacular one involved another cyclist on a fixie--it's always the fucking shitheads on fixies--running a red light and t-boning me because you can't fucking stop quickly on a fixie. (Seriously, don't fucking ride a fixie on public streets or trails, you slack-jawed fucking morons.) My two car incidents were separated by 20-odd years; the first one was in San Diego in the 90s, when a cab cut me off on a steep hill and I tried to put my face through his rear windshield, and the most recent was in Chicago when I got slightly doored (hit my leg, left a huge bruise, but my bike was fine). Otherwise, most of my crashes have involved road conditions, like ice during a sudden winter rainstorm, wet steel plates over construction trenches, or an 8" deep pothole that I couldn't see because it looked like just another puddle. My ex-wife broke her pelvis when she got hit by another cyclist.
In your previous comment, you were equating "Danger" to "Death Rates." How often do you hear of a cyclist dying in an incident that doesn't involve a car?
Yes, accidents and injuries happen. I've literally fallen while walking twice in the past week.
And if that was a car, do you think she would have survived?
First: you said, and I quote, "Riding a bicycle itself isn’t all that dangerous, even without a helmet.". That is blatantly, proveably false, especially when you say that it's not dangerous even without a helmet. I've broken multiple helmet in multiple single-bicycle accidents over the 20-odd years that I was commuting regularly by bicycle; at least one of those would have very likely have been fatal without a helmet.
How many cyclists die outside of interactions with cars? In 2001, 44% of fatal bicycle accidents--377 out of 853--did not involve being hit by, or hitting, a car. So, there ya go. Damn near half of cycling fatalities aren't involving motor vehicles. (The site mentions them as being bicycle transportation fatalities, which seems to exclude bicycle recreation fatalities, but I can't guarantee that they aren't including deaths from mountain biking. Per the same source, helmets appear to reduce the risk of brain trauma by about 60%.)
If she had been in a car, and hit by another car? Yes, I think she would have been fine. Cars have airbags, set belts, and crumple zones. If she'd been hit by a car, while on a bicycle? Can't say. Statistically? Yes.
You seem to be having trouble with reading comprehension. Maybe you need to read things more thoroughly? I'll try to provide some clarification.
I didn't say it's "not dangerous", I said it "isn't all dangerous", which implies there is some danger.
That's not what your source says. "Of the 1,230 bicyclist deaths in 2021, 853 died in motor-vehicle crashes and 377 in other incidents," is what it says, so that 30% that weren't in a direct motor-vehicle crash. Even then, how many were indirectly caused by motor-vehicles? If a bicycle veers out of the way of a car, that's counted as an "other incident". Speed is one of the most dangerous aspects of bicycles and you feel to cycle faster when riding with traffic. Even you previous noted many incidents which are poor infrastructure or maintenance issues.
That's the point...cars are dangerous to people not in cars.